Ethics and Boundaries in YogaTeaching: A Student-Teacher Trust Panel

Aug 19, 2013

6 min read

Watch · 6

A panel of eight yoga teachers—including Sianna Sherman, Eoin Finn, Janet Stone, Jason Nemer, Julia McCabe, Chris Chavez, Schuyler Grant, and Chris Calarco—discusses the often unexamined ethical landscape of yoga teaching. Unlike medicine, law, or psychology, yoga lacks formal regulatory boards, leaving each teacher responsible for self-policing. The panel examines scenarios spanning inappropriate touch, financial boundaries, gifts, and romantic relationships that emerge from student-teacher dynamics. The core argument: a teacher's personal practice becomes the ground from which ethical choices unfold.

Why Yoga Teachers Lack Clear Professional Boundaries

One striking observation from the panel: yoga teaching stands almost alone among helping professions in its absence of formal ethical codes. As Schuyler Grant explains, "If you're a psychotherapist or doctor or priest there are very clear boundaries and laws regarding ethical issues. Like so many things in yoga, it's much more watery—I'm all for there not being boards and rules, but that we need to police and guide ourselves as a community." This structural gap means the responsibility for ethical conduct falls entirely on individual teachers and the culture they create together.

The problem runs deeper than just missing paperwork. Chris Chavez observes that yoga teachers have become "all things to all people" because of the expanded skill and education now required. Yoga teachers are not just movement instructors; they hold a role as guides, mentors, healers, and sometimes quasi-therapists. This expanded responsibility arrives without the institutional safeguards other professions have built over decades.

What Makes Touch in Yoga Teaching Complicated?

Touch is central to yoga—hands-on adjustments deepen poses, demonstrate alignment, and create connection. But this same tool can become a vehicle for harm. Eoin Finn argues that yoga teaching is "officially in the business of touch," and that touch itself is not the problem: "I really do think that we need more touch. But it needs to come from the right place." That right place, Finn suggests, is an internal relationship to what he calls "love"—a grounded presence and intention to serve the student's wellbeing, not the teacher's needs.

The panel distinguishes between caring touch and inappropriate touch through intention and awareness rather than rigid rules. Janet Stone emphasizes the role of trust and self-awareness: if teachers tend to their internal landscape, they can recognize when touch is becoming exploitative. But the burden of this awareness rests entirely on the teacher, creating a vulnerability that transcends written policy.

How Should Teachers Handle Money, Gifts, and Favors?

The panel touches on the sometimes murky territory of financial transactions. A donation system, while maintaining yoga's non-commercial ethos, can obscure power and create confusion. Gifts from students complicate the relationship further—are they expressions of gratitude or attempts to create obligation? The panel does not offer formulaic answers, but instead points to a principle: clarity and intention. Teachers must know why they are accepting or declining money and gifts, and communicate that reasoning to students.

Julia McCabe and others on the panel suggest that transparency about the financial reality of teaching—that it is a livelihood—can actually strengthen relationships. Pretending money doesn't matter can breed resentment on both sides. Acknowledging the economic reality while maintaining ethical integrity requires what Sianna Sherman calls "showing up fully in yourself."

Can Romantic Relationships Emerge Skillfully from Student-Teacher Bonds?

This question generated perhaps the most nuanced discussion. Jason Nemer acknowledges that "there's a lot of yoga scandal that's been happening but I've seen beautiful relationships that stemmed from a student/teacher relationship that were navigated skillfully." His position: the internal compass of each teacher is "the ultimate judge" and relationships that are not sustainable will not sustain anyway. This is not permission for boundary violation; rather, it is recognition that maturity and skill can sometimes transform power dynamics.

However, Chris Calarco offers a stricter position: "To navigate both a relationship and a student/teacher relationship at the same time can't work, they need to be separated." This suggests that if a romantic connection arises, the teaching relationship must end—not as punishment, but as a practical necessity. Once you are in a romantic dynamic, you cannot simultaneously hold the role of teacher for that person without fundamental conflict of interest.

Sianna Sherman's contribution pivots the conversation away from rule-making and toward the teacher's inner work: "The teacher's commitment to their own practice is the ground where it all unfolds. The responsibility is going to have to come from inside each teacher. Know your practice and know it clearly, not guessing or halfway showing up."

What Is the Teacher's Real Responsibility?

The panel repeatedly returns to a single principle: the teacher's own practice and self-knowledge is not a luxury—it is the foundation of ethical conduct. Sherman articulates this most clearly: "If you show up fully in yourself then you can make conscious, skillful choices from the ground of being which love, which is recognition." This is not sentimental language. It means that if you know yourself deeply, you can recognize when you are acting from ego, need, or desire to please, versus from genuine care for the student's growth.

Janet Stone emphasizes the role of transference and projection in student-teacher relationships. Students often project parental figures or idealized versions of themselves onto teachers. Teachers, meanwhile, can find gratification or validation through the admiration of students. Tending to the space within yourself where you can trust yourself—recognizing these dynamics as they arise—is what prevents harm.

How Does a Teacher Balance Being Human and Being a Guide?

Jason Nemer frames this as "affirming yourself as a human before teacher" while simultaneously honoring your role and responsibility. Teachers are not enlightened beings beyond emotion or need. They are humans who happen to hold a particular role. The ethical challenge is to remain aware of both simultaneously—to know your limitations, triggers, and desires while serving your students' development. This dual awareness prevents the inflation of the teacher's importance and keeps the focus on the student's learning.

Eoin Finn's mission to connect students with "love" as a force—and then extend that recognition to community and nature—frames teaching as a practice of expanding circles of responsibility rather than personal spiritual achievement. When a teacher remains grounded in this intention, the power differential becomes less dangerous because it is not being used to feed the teacher's ego.

Where to Go From Here

The panel does not offer a checklist for ethical yoga teaching. Instead, it models a conversation that the yoga community needs to have repeatedly: What are our responsibilities? How do we define them? What happens when those responsibilities conflict? And how do we support each other in upholding them?

The core takeaway is that yoga teachers must do the internal work of knowing their own practice deeply. Boards and rules, the panelists suggest, can only go so far. What matters is the willingness to examine your motives, recognize your projections, and commit to your students' wellbeing ahead of your own comfort. In the absence of external regulation, this internal compass becomes not just a nice idea—it becomes the only safeguard.

Comments

Loading the conversation…

Transcript

[0:02] [Music]

[0:19] um hello I I just wanted to ask really

[0:21] quick how many of you in the audience

[0:23] are

[0:25] teachers all of you great well you can

[0:27] all just snuggle in down here and we'll

[0:29] just talk to each other in a big cuddle

[0:32] puddle um no I I I thought we would just

[0:35] we have a lot of us up here so we'll

[0:38] introduce ourselves one by one and maybe

[0:40] you can just say something briefly about

[0:44] you where you're from and then how you

[0:47] relate to this particular issue at hand

[0:49] which is the student teacher

[0:50] relationship and uh I guess I'll break

[0:53] the ice

[0:55] um so I I have a studio in New York and

[0:58] um I never intended to be a Yoga Studio

[1:01] owner which is probably the way of most

[1:03] yoga studio owners you kind of it hits

[1:05] you sideways but the way that it it came

[1:09] about was um like 10 or 11 years ago I

[1:13] was teaching at a at a studio even like

[1:16] part-time and mostly I was a film editor

[1:18] and the uh the director of that studio

[1:22] it came out was

[1:25] inappropriately what touching uh his

[1:29] students um mostly female students and

[1:32] it was you know it was really intense

[1:33] for all of us in the in the teaching

[1:37] Community there and so we kind of

[1:40] decided we had to leave but then we had

[1:41] to make a new home and um that's how my

[1:44] studio came to be it was really like

[1:46] okay what we need to make a refuge and

[1:48] I'm going to just going to do this for a

[1:49] year while we have this place to all

[1:52] kind of keep going and teaching on our

[1:54] students to come to and um and then you

[1:57] know 10 years later in the mines still

[1:59] but um but so I feel really connected to

[2:03] that that this particular issue which is

[2:05] of course only one aspect of

[2:08] the of the student teacher relationship

[2:10] and the obviously one which has

[2:12] resonated a lot this year and I just

[2:15] also want to say in getting started that

[2:17] that's what everything that happened

[2:19] with John friend and Ana SAR and it's

[2:21] happened you know many times and over

[2:23] and over again in in in the yoga world

[2:26] and in the larger wellness world and in

[2:29] the World At Large

[2:30] I want to also get beyond that as well

[2:32] we can certainly talk about talk about

[2:35] anasara but I'd also like to talk about

[2:37] the all of the other responsibilities

[2:39] that come up in the in the student

[2:41] teacher relationship as well as all of

[2:43] the incredible

[2:45] positive parts of that

[2:48] responsibility so um I will pass the mic

[2:51] to you okay my name is Ian and I'm a

[2:56] blissology and a surfer and I'm I I was

[2:59] just trying to answer where I live

[3:00] it's a difficult question but I live at

[3:02] many beaches around the

[3:04] world and I don't have a studio because

[3:07] I like to Surf and uh means I'm a bit of

[3:11] a commitment F but I do interact with a

[3:14] lot of students and I run teachers

[3:16] trainings and um you know I actually

[3:18] think we need more touch I really do I

[3:22] think that um you know I tell all the

[3:24] students in our teachers training that

[3:25] welcome to the world of yoga teaching

[3:27] and when you enter this world you are

[3:29] actually officially in the business of

[3:31] touch and um but it needs to come from

[3:33] the right place and uh you know my whole

[3:36] mission is to get in touch with this

[3:38] Force called love and uh to use it to be

[3:43] uh kind to my own body and our own

[3:45] bodies and to develop uh that same sense

[3:48] of kindness to our communities and to

[3:51] Nature and that's why I call blissology

[3:53] but just as as side that's why I'm

[3:55] stoked to be here at Wanderlust cuz it

[3:57] seems like that's going on here too and

[4:00] it's

[4:02] awesome hi there I'm Julia maab and uh

[4:05] I'm really quite excited because I live

[4:07] here in Whistler so it's pretty cool to

[4:09] have um amazing teachers here in my

[4:12] hometown I'm uh not used to speaking in

[4:14] a microphone I have sweaty

[4:18] armpits we're in front of people but um

[4:21] I'm here mainly because I I'm remember

[4:24] one am honored to speak amongst some

[4:27] amazing teachers but also I think it is

[4:29] a it's a it is a Hot Topic this year

[4:31] officially and um I too also have been

[4:34] uh holding teacher trainings for the

[4:35] last two years in Nicaragua and around

[4:38] the world I'm a little bit of a vagabond

[4:40] as well um between Whistler and

[4:42] everywhere else and uh yeah I think it's

[4:45] I think it's important um well I just

[4:48] want to actually just get into this

[4:49] discussion of it and see what comes

[4:51] about it organically and and give my two

[4:53] cents and also just hear some insight

[4:56] into what everyone else has to say

[5:02] I'm Chris Chavis and uh I'm technically

[5:05] from Los Angeles but also I live on

[5:08] planes uh so I get the chance to train

[5:10] teachers all over the world we do

[5:12] workshops trainings and and public

[5:14] classes and it is a very uh difficult

[5:18] issue and one of the things that uh I

[5:20] mean you just look at these amazing

[5:22] people up here and one of the things

[5:24] that I've realized in this past year and

[5:25] just actually from being invited to

[5:27] speak here is that um I think probably

[5:30] for the first time uh in yoga history

[5:33] and and possibly not I may be wrong but

[5:35] yoga teachers are becoming all things to

[5:37] all people uh because of the level of

[5:40] skill and education that the yoga

[5:42] teachers now have um there's a lot more

[5:44] responsibility on us as to what it what

[5:47] what it is we are doing and what we're

[5:49] sharing and obviously how we go about

[5:52] doing that is the question and um yeah

[5:55] and this is going to be an interesting

[5:57] debate and uh keep your hands with

[6:00] within the boundaries of the chair

[6:03] okay or

[6:05] not hi I'm Jason Nemer um I got an email

[6:09] from my friend Siana maybe six months

[6:11] ago she like you have to be on this

[6:13] panel and I saw the email I'm like this

[6:15] is just a spam email I didn't see it it

[6:17] never happened there's no way I'm going

[6:19] to sit on this panel this is just asking

[6:21] for a lot of fire and then I you know I

[6:25] felt the fire initially and I thought

[6:26] okay this is this is something that

[6:28] means something to me so when the second

[6:30] an email came from say I haven't heard

[6:31] back from you yet do you I was like okay

[6:34] I I really want to step up and to be

[6:36] able to share my perspective share my

[6:39] experiences and you know this is

[6:41] something that will never go away this

[6:43] is not something that we can solve but

[6:44] this is something that we have the

[6:46] opportunity to become more and more

[6:48] skillful and find the commonality

[6:51] between many different perspectives of

[6:53] what what is a skillful way to interact

[6:55] with students what is an honorable way

[6:57] to affirm yourself as a human before

[7:00] teacher and how does that how does that

[7:02] dance work with affirming what yourself

[7:05] is as a human and what your title or

[7:07] responsibility is as a teacher so I'm

[7:10] I'm excited to be here and thank you SI

[7:11] for the invitation for thisan forced

[7:15] invitation hi I'm Janet Stone and um hi

[7:19] I'm here because of her as well so um

[7:23] I'm based out of San Francisco and you

[7:25] know when when this came up it was to me

[7:28] the topic of trust that really sparked

[7:30] an interest and what that is to to have

[7:34] within yourself a trust and how that

[7:36] plays in the teachers that come into

[7:37] your life and also just in the sense of

[7:41] trusting yourself to remain a student

[7:43] and um on this journey it's it's there's

[7:47] a ton of projection there's a ton of uh

[7:50] transference and counter transference

[7:52] and all sorts of exciting stuff that can

[7:55] happen but if we really tend to that

[7:58] space within ourselves that we can trust

[8:02] and I feel like the teachers come our

[8:04] way and they come you know the students

[8:07] come our way as well so it's this

[8:09] counterbalance as well so I will be

[8:11] moving my hands outside the framework of

[8:13] my chairs as I pass this on to

[8:18] SI hello I'm Siana Sherman

[8:22] and I'm I'm feel really blessed to be on

[8:25] this panel I feel like it's time for us

[8:29] to have a beautiful mature conversation

[8:33] in the company of friends and open minds

[8:37] and courageous hearts and my wish is

[8:40] that this discussion really truly be for

[8:42] the benefit of all beings and that we

[8:45] can learn from each other and that yoga

[8:48] as a whole in our um worldwide Global

[8:51] yoga Community can actually flourish and

[8:54] Thrive from these types of conversations

[8:57] in the way that we're willing to show up

[8:59] you know in our our eles for ourselves

[9:01] and with each other and essentially my

[9:04] whole life has been um de devoted to

[9:08] being a student at of many different

[9:11] traditions and I've interacted with so

[9:14] many kinds of teachers along the way and

[9:17] I've become a teacher along the way but

[9:19] I primarily consider myself a student

[9:21] and so right now in this moment I am

[9:24] definitely a student on this panel

[9:27] and I I just want to thank everyone for

[9:30] coming so thanks for having and giving

[9:32] us the

[9:35] opportunity hi my name is Chris kerco

[9:38] and primarily I'm here because I'm Si's

[9:42] student and

[9:44] um and I think like you just heard Siana

[9:46] say that's generally how I I think of

[9:49] myself I think of myself as a student um

[9:51] I do teach yoga classes um in Portland

[9:54] Oregon where I live but I think of

[9:58] myself primarily as a student but I'm

[10:01] now starting to

[10:03] um I guess step into that role of of

[10:06] being a teacher you know inside myself a

[10:09] little bit more so I'm kind of on both

[10:10] sides of the fence and

[10:14] um yeah it's good for

[10:19] now so I want to make sure that we have

[10:24] aing we got it so we can kind of share

[10:27] two mics between each people and that

[10:28] way will messy so me and I will share

[10:31] and you guys can share so um I think one

[10:35] of the things that that is it's it's

[10:37] very interesting to me and and I and

[10:39] comes up a lot is the

[10:43] uh unarticulated nature of the of the

[10:48] yoga teacher in in regard to ethics

[10:51] because you know if you're a if you're a

[10:53] psychotherapist or you're a doctor or

[10:54] you're a

[10:55] priest um there are very clear

[10:59] guidelines

[11:00] boundaries and um and laws regarding

[11:04] ethical issues and it's you know like so

[11:07] many things in the world of yoga it's

[11:10] much more watery which is great I mean

[11:14] it's when I'm all for I just speaking

[11:17] personally I'm all for there not being

[11:19] boards and rules and the people who say

[11:23] exactly how how things should be and

[11:26] that we need to police and guide

[11:30] ourselves as a community of teachers and

[11:33] practitioners I think is one of the

[11:35] things that makes our our world so

[11:38] powerful but it's also it's very

[11:42] difficult to

[11:43] navigate and um and and there and there

[11:45] are lots and the boundaries are much

[11:47] more blurred than they would be in those

[11:49] other professions and ironically those

[11:52] are I mean the role of psychotherapist

[11:54] and doctor and priest or Priestess are

[11:59] the roles that that we're all playing at

[12:01] different times and it's a funny it's we

[12:03] all wear a lot of hats as teachers but

[12:05] there're but none of them are very

[12:07] clearly defined so I'm curious for those

[12:10] of you who who want to speak to it what

[12:13] you feel are the are the boundaries um

[12:17] on the on the not negative side but are

[12:20] the boundaries the containers that we

[12:21] need to put on ourselves as teachers and

[12:24] also the responsibilities on the

[12:26] positive side what are our

[12:28] responsibilities to our student students

[12:30] as guides as as teachers so I kind of

[12:34] open the

[12:35] floor looks like you're going to have to

[12:37] like pick people all right well okay so

[12:40] I I'm gonna I'll ask you Chris um you

[12:43] yeah you you just spoke up so you got it

[12:45] well one thing that you said that that

[12:46] that resonates a lot is that in in this

[12:50] emergent culture of yoga which is

[12:52] getting bigger and broader we are

[12:54] becoming more and more things to more

[12:56] people right so with that um give me you

[12:59] know give me your feelings on on the on

[13:02] the the framework that you see and in

[13:04] teacher trainings what do you say to

[13:06] your teacher trainees about about the

[13:09] student teacher relationship um well

[13:12] it's very clear that when you're a

[13:14] teacher especially when you're U an

[13:16] established teacher um students are

[13:19] coming to you for many things as as you

[13:22] described uh and that gives you a sense

[13:24] of power they they're literally giving

[13:26] you power um how you define that and

[13:28] what it is it's is as you said it's also

[13:30] not that clear um and so I think for me

[13:34] when I teach teachers is I I train them

[13:37] and I teach them that you have to honor

[13:38] that power because that that power comes

[13:41] with a high level of uh

[13:44] responsibility and uh when we are when

[13:47] you're teaching from the the place that

[13:50] is your truth you have to make sure that

[13:52] you're doing so in a way that is

[13:54] bringing out the truth of this the

[13:55] person that you are teaching and that

[13:58] student is a student because they may

[14:00] not know the way and your your job is to

[14:03] guide them in all areas of that way and

[14:07] I think sometimes what happens is um we

[14:10] are also human we're all human and so as

[14:13] we're moving forward along that path

[14:14] with the student it will waver sometimes

[14:17] and often times we don't know where the

[14:19] boundaries are until we've knocked up

[14:21] against them sometimes but don't you or

[14:24] do you find

[14:27] that within the context of being a a

[14:30] yoga teacher very often you are prepared

[14:34] or you've prepared yourself in your own

[14:36] path to be a guide of certain things and

[14:39] then it's asked of you yes to be a

[14:42] teacher and a leader and a a a a a force

[14:48] in something that you don't even feel

[14:50] that you're prepared to um I think two I

[14:54] think probably some of the issues that

[14:56] come up is is is often not just black

[14:58] and white as like a touch or something

[15:01] like that I mean sometimes the way that

[15:03] students will put their um their give

[15:05] you their power put give you power it's

[15:08] it's uh it's you don't recognize it

[15:11] sometimes it's not so clear I mean I had

[15:13] a student for example for uh many years

[15:16] he was a really good student of mine and

[15:18] you know he shared every aspect of his

[15:20] life with me you know and this started

[15:22] to grow and grow and grow and I just for

[15:24] a long time thought he was my friend and

[15:26] we're friends and he's my student until

[15:28] he gives me an envelope pull of cash

[15:31] right and it's like oh what do I do

[15:32] with this you know and and that was that

[15:35] was bumping up against did you it I I

[15:38] donated it to charity actually but it

[15:40] was I didn't know what to do with it

[15:41] because I'd never yeah just here's an

[15:44] envelope for your birthday here you go

[15:46] and and I said no this is inappropriate

[15:48] you know it's it's beyond this

[15:50] relationship it's not appropriate please

[15:51] take it back and he said No I gave it to

[15:54] you it's it you know and so that was the

[15:56] very first time that i' actually bumped

[15:58] up against a boundary because I was

[16:00] really just giving everything I had to

[16:02] whoever wanted to take it right and um

[16:05] and that was the first time that I

[16:06] actually realized wow there's there's

[16:08] some there's some really blurry edges

[16:10] here that you have to really be careful

[16:12] with you know and I've I've got and did

[16:14] did that change your relationship with

[16:15] that student did you have to set up like

[16:17] a set bound had to set boundaries and uh

[16:20] and I actually had to push him towards

[16:22] another teacher push him away basically

[16:24] you know and it was it was very

[16:26] difficult because as a teacher you want

[16:29] you wanting students right you but there

[16:31] was I could recognize after that that it

[16:34] was an unhealthy relationship you know

[16:36] what was he expecting from the cash I

[16:39] that's the not time I don't know I

[16:41] that's that's the problem you know is

[16:42] that they're that they uh a lot of times

[16:44] it's not clear even what students are

[16:47] expecting so at that point I always I

[16:49] just backed up and I said okay I have to

[16:51] make sure when I'm giving I give but I

[16:53] don't receive anything of expectation or

[16:56] and start to recognize it sooner as well

[16:59] yeah I I so I'll ask you Ian has

[17:02] anything ever happened for you in with a

[17:06] student that's felt like it's it's gone

[17:09] beyond the comfortable bounds of that

[17:11] relationship

[17:13] um yeah definitely I mean there's

[17:18] uh there's a uh a deep sharing of your

[17:22] soul when you're teaching yoga you are

[17:26] definitely you know we all talk about

[17:27] this this is not just a physical

[17:29] thing you know it's not this triangle

[17:31] pose but you are sharing the deepest

[17:33] part of you and and it is a it is

[17:35] definitely a physical thing and um you

[17:37] know there's definitely

[17:39] uh people who can become attracted

[17:43] because of that and um and what you have

[17:47] to do in those situations is really tune

[17:49] in I mean it kind of I just want to

[17:51] answer your original question it ties in

[17:53] with this and I don't really think so

[17:55] much about boundaries I think more about

[17:57] intention and for me what how I wrestle

[17:59] with this question is um what's what's

[18:02] my intention and the great thing about

[18:03] yoga is even when you're doing a

[18:06] physical yoga pose you know level one do

[18:08] this and if you want to go deeper why

[18:11] you know even at a 101 level we're

[18:13] trying to check in all the time and I

[18:15] think this is our work as yoga

[18:18] instructors and um as Chris was saying

[18:21] people with power is to really check in

[18:22] why we're doing what we're doing and and

[18:25] when I when I heard you ask the question

[18:27] what I was your original question and

[18:29] what I was thinking is it's the same

[18:31] thing I try and teach now my kid is that

[18:34] two things I mean I think kids will be

[18:36] fine no matter what experience they have

[18:39] if they have love in their life right

[18:42] and if they understand that their

[18:44] actions have

[18:45] consequences and this is what you need

[18:47] to do as a yoga instructor is really

[18:50] understand I mean me personally I feel

[18:51] like I'm I am a conduit for love that's

[18:55] what I'm doing and and what is

[18:57] love it's a difficult question I mean

[19:00] YouTube it and you get blackeyed Peas I

[19:03] did this I mean you get the blackeyed

[19:05] pe's and you actually get the Scorpions

[19:08] um you know so it's it's a complicated

[19:10] thing but to me what love is is it's the

[19:12] opposite of

[19:14] selfishness right and so there's a

[19:16] balance between your own personal

[19:18] desires and what you want and and you

[19:21] know your ego drive and then you have

[19:23] your connection to other people and what

[19:25] parenting teaches you is that actually

[19:27] someone else's needs are more important

[19:29] important

[19:31] and all the time I mean as a yoga

[19:34] instructor I think that it's your

[19:35] obligation to come back to that very

[19:38] basic model 15 20 times a day and check

[19:42] in like where are you on your balance um

[19:44] so to answer that in terms of your

[19:46] second question you know or even

[19:48] hypothetically let's say someone was

[19:49] interested in a sexual relationship or I

[19:53] mean I would just look at that and go

[19:55] that's me just on this side of the

[19:57] balance just concerned about my own

[19:58] selfish desires and and I'm not really

[20:01] looking at my connection to someone

[20:03] actually by going there I would create

[20:05] great harm I mean I would create harm to

[20:09] my relationships um someone I'm married

[20:12] to obviously um I would create harm

[20:14] probably to this person right and am I

[20:17] in the yoga business to harm people no

[20:21] I'm not and um but what if you I mean I

[20:24] have plenty of yoga teacher friends

[20:27] who've dated people who who were their

[20:29] students on the female and the male side

[20:31] and there is a

[20:32] time when you know you're you're having

[20:35] a there's a student that you're

[20:37] attracted to and they're attracted to

[20:38] you in a certain point you want to shift

[20:40] that relationship so I'm just curious to

[20:42] know I'll ask actually Janet have you

[20:45] have you ever dated no I mean we can all

[20:48] open this up but I I figure this is I

[20:50] mean this is

[20:51] obviously I don't I'm not it's not

[20:54] because I know anything about your

[20:55] personal life Janet tell us you're

[20:57] welcome to pass the m mic after you

[20:59] answer um but have you ever been in a

[21:01] situation where you've had there's been

[21:03] an attraction with a student and then

[21:05] you have to change the change the

[21:08] relationship in order to have a

[21:10] relationship with Integrity I guess is

[21:12] my question because it's absurd to say

[21:14] okay teachers can never date their

[21:16] students it just has to be done in in a

[21:20] respectful way where you you obviously

[21:22] are you go you go from being teacher and

[21:25] student

[21:27] before it's the relationship evolves to

[21:30] me that's that seems to be the the first

[21:33] clear step but um it's never happened to

[21:35] me I've been married for like 500 years

[21:37] so first of all I just want to know if

[21:39] these pants are

[21:42] inappropriate no no okay not at all yeah

[21:46] you're good okay it's all right okay

[21:47] then okay option um I have she's amazing

[21:52] under take them off because this

[21:53] actually thank you thank you no I

[21:57] feel I do feel a little bit better no I

[22:00] would never ever No it's it's B

[22:02] basically goes back to to what Ian was

[22:04] saying about um intention and integrity

[22:08] of course and also Clarity of um what

[22:12] the teachings are I mean I feel like

[22:13] teachers now are are no longer gurus in

[22:16] in our current culture and they're not

[22:18] aerobics teachers so we we're we're sort

[22:20] of somewhere in this weird slide and the

[22:23] conversation is now just beginning It

[22:25] Feels Like To Me Maybe it's been going

[22:27] on for a while but how do you make that

[22:29] transition how do you actually look

[22:32] toward what are the responsibilities for

[22:35] both people who are showing up that

[22:37] means the student and the

[22:39] teacher where you know in the sense of

[22:42] power you know I heard that term a

[22:43] couple of times and it just feels

[22:46] like as the teacher yes maybe someone

[22:49] wants to hand me their power but what

[22:51] I'm here for is actually as a conduit as

[22:53] a reflection back not so much to hold

[22:55] anybody's power for them my my journey

[22:59] fully is to just um reflect that back

[23:02] and really tend my own Road daily minute

[23:05] by minute second by second to make sure

[23:08] that my

[23:09] intention um is coming from the place I

[23:12] want it to come from because once again

[23:13] I mean there is there's a lot of Muddy

[23:15] Waters there's a lot of narcissism

[23:17] that's being fed and not I'm not saying

[23:20] that in a negative term it's just the

[23:21] ego of of both the teacher wanting to be

[23:25] uplifted and also um the student wanting

[23:28] to be

[23:29] uh seen and and sort of like you know

[23:33] carried like oh yes great and and sort

[23:35] of there's an agreement that happens

[23:37] sometimes to feed this type of dynamic

[23:40] and it's sort of um bringing light and

[23:42] awareness and even just acknowledgement

[23:44] into what that is you know and it

[23:47] happens um on such subtle levels and it

[23:49] happens on really big levels and and I

[23:51] feel like you know the amount of the

[23:53] touch the SE I mean I feel like that is

[23:55] just some very um um small well it can

[24:01] be big but byproduct of what of what the

[24:04] key the root is here of what what what

[24:07] are the teachings that are happening and

[24:10] yeah what is being sort of offered back

[24:12] and forth Jason do you have anything you

[24:13] want to say about this yeah that was a

[24:15] big evasion I mean interesting but I

[24:18] mean I guess I would say forget you I

[24:21] don't mean to ask about your personal

[24:23] life but I think it is it is an

[24:24] important thing to be able to talk about

[24:25] one second and I'd love to hear what you

[24:26] have to say but I but let's just say

[24:29] what what are you going to say to your

[24:30] teacher trainees if they were to ask

[24:31] well what if I have a student and I'm

[24:35] actually genuinely attracted to them and

[24:37] I I've thought about it and I know that

[24:39] it's not just a passing thing and I want

[24:41] to actually like how do I do this

[24:43] responsibly so what would you say I mean

[24:45] anybody who wants to speak i' love to

[24:46] chime in here so I don't know why it is

[24:49] I don't know if it's human nature I

[24:50] don't know if it's Western culture but

[24:52] you put the news on and you see all the

[24:54] gnarly things that happen in the world

[24:55] and you don't see the Beautiful Stories

[24:57] so I wanted to share a few beautiful

[24:59] stories that I've witnessed I was at

[25:00] this Retreat Center uh in Santa Barbara

[25:03] and there's this probably 60-year-old

[25:06] Mexican woman 60-year-old white guy and

[25:08] they came into the teacher training and

[25:09] they were offering their they do some

[25:12] Shamanism they do some different things

[25:14] like we just wanted to tell you our

[25:15] story because you guys are going to be

[25:17] yoga teachers and we have a really sweet

[25:19] story the woman was a yoga teacher the

[25:21] guy was the student and you know he

[25:23] shows up to the class and they fell in

[25:25] love and you don't choose who you fall

[25:27] in love with I in my experience love is

[25:30] you know one of the things you said

[25:31] about love is like how do you define it

[25:32] you know you YouTube it you Google it

[25:35] love is something that is a really

[25:36] mystical energy and we we work with

[25:39] mystical energies in this practice so

[25:41] when you fall in love with somebody from

[25:43] there there's a lot of very intelligent

[25:46] discernment choices that you can make

[25:48] based on your experience based on the

[25:49] people around you and they've lived like

[25:52] 40-year life together super in love some

[25:55] of you guys know the yoga Slackers Jason

[25:57] and Chelsea I talked to them they said

[25:59] it was okay I could bring up their story

[26:01] um Jason uh he went to a teacher

[26:04] training as a guest teacher for like

[26:06] three days as soon as he walked in the

[26:08] room Chelsea saw him he like oh my God

[26:10] that's my husband she saw it clearly she

[26:12] knew it he didn't see her at all in the

[26:14] beginning and you know there was some

[26:16] energy that was exchanged and every

[26:19] circumstance is going to have such a

[26:21] unique thing and something that I've

[26:22] learned from one of my um teachers he

[26:24] says there's not one technique for 100

[26:27] students but there's 100 techniques for

[26:29] one student so every individual

[26:32] relationship that you have as a yoga

[26:34] teacher you have a lot of opportunity to

[26:36] be very skillful in how you act and

[26:38] right now there is a lot of yoga Scandal

[26:40] that's been you know spread through all

[26:43] the different uh social media channels

[26:45] and people are reading that and really

[26:46] fixated on that and I've seen a lot of

[26:49] really beautiful relationships that come

[26:50] out of a teacher student relationship

[26:52] that can be navigated skillfully and in

[26:54] my experience the way that it can be

[26:57] skillful myself as a teacher am I doing

[27:00] things that I feel like I have to hide

[27:02] am I doing things that I feel like I

[27:04] could tell my mom about and this is my

[27:06] internal compass and everyone has a

[27:08] different internal compass and

[27:10] non-sustainable activities will not

[27:12] sustain if you're doing things that are

[27:13] hurting people again and again it's not

[27:16] going to bode well for you as a yoga

[27:18] teacher so I think to some degree these

[27:20] things work themselves out and it

[27:21] doesn't mean that you shouldn't talk

[27:22] about it I love that we're talking about

[27:24] it but I think that it can be balanced

[27:26] in how we look at things and um it is

[27:29] gray as as it has already been said so

[27:32] so do you feel and I'm I'll ask you but

[27:35] I'm curious to to know from anybody here

[27:37] do you feel like there is a place in our

[27:40] community

[27:42] for guidelines I mean because there are

[27:45] and there aren't you know everything at

[27:47] the end of the day right now you know

[27:49] there's teachings and there's precedent

[27:51] and there's you know basic human ethics

[27:54] but there there there isn't much in the

[27:57] way of

[27:59] of navigating rules and like I said I

[28:02] mean I'm all for kind of Anarchy Anarchy

[28:06] it because it creates a it creates

[28:09] choice and individuality and and

[28:11] creativity but sometimes it would be

[28:14] nice to have a touchstone so I I I still

[28:18] am I'm still interested to know what any

[28:20] of you who have a an opinion about it

[28:23] would say to uh a fellow teacher who

[28:25] came to you or a teacher trainee who

[28:27] came to you about how do I handle this

[28:29] I'd like to to chime in yeah um so it's

[28:32] a conversation I've been having

[28:34] recently and what's been offered to me

[28:37] and the thoughts that I've had around it

[28:39] that if you're going

[28:41] to if someone's your student and you're

[28:44] going you're interested they're

[28:45] interested in you you're interested in

[28:47] them it's probably good for them not to

[28:49] be your

[28:50] student at while you're initiating that

[28:54] relationship and to set that boundary as

[28:57] the relationship happen s if the

[28:58] relationship continues to flourish and

[29:01] they living happily ever after for the

[29:02] next 5 10 years then they might come to

[29:04] your class but it to to navigate both of

[29:09] those relationships at the same time

[29:11] starting a relationship and continuing a

[29:13] yoga teacher yoga student relationship

[29:16] has a lot of is is could be quite

[29:18] fraught with the power differential yeah

[29:22] I think that's that's the difficult

[29:25] thing is knowing when it's a

[29:27] differential and when it's just just

[29:29] chemistry right and I think uh I think I

[29:32] mean there's there's probably many

[29:34] markers and as much as there's not um

[29:37] one of the things when all of this stuff

[29:39] was happening this past year and I I

[29:41] think you're exactly right when you said

[29:42] this internal Compass uh the word Dharma

[29:45] was pushed around a lot and you heard it

[29:47] a lot and one of the interesting things

[29:49] that I thought is that Dharma or truth

[29:51] is has its own Survival mechanism it has

[29:54] its own life energy and so um if it is

[29:57] damaged in any way it'll sort itself out

[30:01] and uh in that when these things when we

[30:04] when our Dharma is not uh being served I

[30:07] think in some scale is it will affect us

[30:10] in our lives and like you said the

[30:12] internal Compass will either serve you

[30:14] well or bring you down can you give me

[30:16] an

[30:17] example you're

[30:19] just no I'm curious I mean in a from

[30:22] yourself or just in your experience no I

[30:25] mean it's it's Main you know like uh in

[30:30] my early days of teaching uh you know I

[30:33] was very much about giving is and and

[30:35] like he talked about the concept of love

[30:38] you know and um and when there are many

[30:41] people that will come and they need love

[30:42] in their life and there's many people

[30:44] who are lonely and they need

[30:46] companionship and they will come to the

[30:48] yoga teacher and if the yoga teacher is

[30:49] just open giving giving giving they

[30:52] sometimes misinterpret that uh they will

[30:55] take it in in the wrong way um but as he

[30:58] said there there needs to be more touch

[31:00] um I had an example in a yoga class when

[31:02] I was a young teacher and and it was it

[31:04] it really affected me for the rest of my

[31:07] up until now I had a student that came

[31:09] into my class and she was just doing a

[31:11] downward facing dog and I just put my

[31:13] hand on her back and she started to cry

[31:15] and I was I was a little freaked out I

[31:17] was like oh what did I do you know and

[31:19] she came up and she said well you may

[31:21] not be able to appreciate this because

[31:22] you're a young guy she said but um you

[31:25] know I'm in my late 50s early 60s and

[31:27] when you touch touched me I I couldn't

[31:29] remember when the last time I was

[31:31] touched with affection was and oh I'm

[31:33] going to cry

[31:34] now um yeah so in that sense I was I was

[31:38] I was really blown away so as Ian said

[31:41] there is uh here I'll give it to you

[31:44] make sure finish no no I'm G to cry he's

[31:46] going to cry but you know you know I

[31:48] mean I love what everyone said so far

[31:51] really with everyone but uh you know

[31:53] when someone's not coming from that

[31:55] space that Chris is trying to describe

[31:57] right like um I'm actually coming back

[31:59] to question you asked me a while ago now

[32:01] sorry I keep answering your questions

[32:03] after you ask me a couple but um but uh

[32:08] I was actually thinking about it I'm

[32:09] like I I I start every yoga class with a

[32:12] hug like I mean everyone we hug that's

[32:14] what we do I'm not joking I'm I we

[32:17] literally it's non-authoritarian it

[32:19] freaks people out from the East

[32:22] Coast but that's what we do it's non

[32:24] Authority you don't have to but um and

[32:27] and um and I think that's what people

[32:29] need I mean we live in a world where if

[32:31] you cut yourself as a school kid uh the

[32:34] teachers can't put Band-Aids on you I

[32:36] mean we've completely let go of touch um

[32:39] which is horrible and I think we got to

[32:40] counter that but you know when someone's

[32:43] coming from a place where they they have

[32:46] power which was what Chris was

[32:48] addressing before and they're just

[32:49] taking advantage of that you know

[32:51] basically it's an unlevel playing field

[32:53] like you are not you you're this person

[32:57] that uh

[32:58] when they see you the person will kind

[33:01] of throw their moral judgment away and

[33:03] just like this guy's a guru or this guy

[33:05] is um a rock star and actually that's

[33:08] one thing I want to mention is you know

[33:10] I saw this movie last night about it and

[33:11] I think this might help our conversation

[33:13] too because it's so personal as yogis

[33:16] and what Janet was saying are we gurus

[33:17] or are we yoga teachers I mean one thing

[33:19] that gets thrown around a lot is Yogi

[33:20] rock stars and I mean it's like we're

[33:23] musicians no I mean no matter what you

[33:25] know what what musicians do and what

[33:27] yogis do is as mus as a yogi um people

[33:30] you know you walk around like life is

[33:31] pretty good or maybe it's all about

[33:33] worries or problems and then you know

[33:34] they do it when you hear good music you

[33:36] basically go you hear the song and all

[33:39] of a sudden you're like oh my God life

[33:40] is amazing let's sing and this is what

[33:43] we do as yoga teachers as we get people

[33:46] to sing inside you know and so it's this

[33:49] elevation I think this is the connection

[33:50] between yogis and maybe not rock stars

[33:52] but musicians uh so where I'm going with

[33:55] this is and and and and hopefully this

[33:57] makes it less personal for us is I

[33:59] watched a documentary last night about a

[34:02] musician and I won't mention the name

[34:04] but I mean this is someone who I love

[34:06] you know one of my top five uh musicians

[34:08] I admire and uh his wife was in the band

[34:12] and he had affairs all over the world

[34:15] with all these different um I don't know

[34:18] groupies um whatever you would call them

[34:21] and uh to me it I went oh it doesn't

[34:24] really fit with how I would do things

[34:26] and even when I was listening to the

[34:27] music that he was teaching and like

[34:29] doesn't really fit there but there's two

[34:31] things one is you realize that some

[34:33] people when they do what they're doing

[34:34] whether it's teaching yoga or not

[34:36] there's something that comes through

[34:37] them in that moment and it brings out

[34:39] their best you know and then that kind

[34:41] of hypnotizes other people to um not

[34:46] view their actions outside of that you

[34:49] know and um and and I think I'm I'm all

[34:53] for not having guidelines you know I'm

[34:55] with you but we have to have a a

[34:56] check-in all the time time right and and

[35:00] the people in relationship I mean yoga

[35:02] is really about the yoga of relationship

[35:04] the people all involved with that

[35:05] relationship need to H talk it out so

[35:08] this guy who's a musician not a yoga

[35:10] teacher he's a musician and he said he

[35:12] needs to say to his wife who's in the

[35:13] band hey I'm going to Shag this woman

[35:16] now and um he has to say look to her I'm

[35:19] in a committed relationship or you know

[35:21] I'm in a relationship anyway and are you

[35:23] cool with this and this has to and and I

[35:28] don't know probably if you look at that

[35:29] scenario someone's going to get hurt you

[35:32] know and so really as a musician or yoga

[35:34] teacher you have to go am I okay with

[35:36] hurting someone in order to me feel my

[35:39] physical needs and maybe abuse power to

[35:41] get there but I would go so far as to

[35:43] say that that that I and I do agree with

[35:46] you that there there are um there are

[35:49] similarities in the in the role of the

[35:54] musician and the and the yoga teacher

[35:55] just in that just by virtue of leading

[35:58] something leading something that

[36:00] inspires good feelings in people is it

[36:02] creates that Dynamic but if you're you

[36:06] know no one judges a rock star for

[36:10] proflat fathering or mothering fathering

[36:14] you know multiple children out of

[36:15] wedlock or whatever married or not

[36:18] married is really immaterial but I think

[36:21] the the the difficulty with being a yoga

[36:24] teacher is we don't take vows we aren't

[36:27] we don't have don't you know the the the

[36:30] priest who has to Le be defrocked in

[36:32] order to get married it's very clear

[36:35] what's happening if we're talking about

[36:37] these you know moving past these

[36:39] boundaries but we don't have these

[36:40] boundaries and very often I feel like

[36:43] yoga teachers we sort of slip into this

[36:46] role of having a greater responsibility

[36:50] to our we start out teaching AA yeah

[36:53] most of the time we start out oh I love

[36:55] this this feels good I'm going to start

[36:56] teaching this and then it gets

[36:58] much heavier and people come to you

[37:01] because they're sick and you you become

[37:04] you become responsible for their

[37:07] wellness and or helping them through

[37:10] their sickness or their parent dying or

[37:13] their child's Pro I mean it be it gets

[37:16] very deep very quickly if you continue

[37:19] long enough and we I and it's just it's

[37:23] it's a it's a really it's it's a tough

[37:25] it's tough to be able to assume that

[37:29] role responsibly when you haven't really

[37:32] prepared yourself for it unless you just

[37:33] happen to have a very strong moral

[37:35] compass and so yes jenet one sec I guess

[37:38] one thing that I would like to ask

[37:40] anybody who really wants to speak to it

[37:42] is because we don't have um we don't

[37:46] have board we don't have ethics boards

[37:48] and we don't we even have a book or a

[37:51] manual that talks about this how do you

[37:55] handle this when it happens among your

[37:57] peers

[38:00] you can pipe in I'm going old school

[38:02] please has anyone heard of the eight

[38:06] limbs I know I've uh I'm just going to

[38:10] pull out the eight limbs as as the the

[38:12] rules and guidelines I mean it's a moral

[38:14] compass is very movable it's a movable

[38:18] thing and I feel like the eight limbs if

[38:20] you're actually um in this practice and

[38:22] really immersed in this

[38:25] practice and not just doing a chatarunga

[38:28] actually with Aima and with truthfulness

[38:32] and it aligns up from heels to Crown of

[38:34] the head but it lines up from when you

[38:36] wake up in the morning to when you go to

[38:37] bed and I just wanted to hand it off to

[38:39] SI and see if she had anything to

[38:41] say thank you I like the old school

[38:45] thanks what what I'm thinking about

[38:47] really is the teachers commitment to

[38:50] their own

[38:51] practices as the ground for all of this

[38:56] to unfold it it's I mean there there can

[38:59] be the conversation of what we should do

[39:01] from the outside in the way of creating

[39:04] a code of conduct and you know a

[39:06] touchstone as you said which is a nice

[39:09] way to say it but ultimately the

[39:12] responsibility is going to have to be a

[39:14] natural and spontaneous upsurge from the

[39:17] grounds of being inside each teacher and

[39:21] in yoga you know no matter what

[39:23] tradition or style we're practicing

[39:26] every single tradition of Y yoga calls

[39:28] us to

[39:29] self-recognition calls us to practice so

[39:32] that we polish the mirror of our hearts

[39:34] so that we can really see the situation

[39:37] clearly and when those

[39:40] situations arise that we remember the

[39:43] vamara shaki the reflective power of the

[39:47] moment to that whatever the situation is

[39:50] it has to bounce back inside of us to

[39:52] look deeper and to grow ourselves

[39:54] because of that so you know I I I shared

[39:58] a relationship with a man for 5 years

[40:01] that began as my student and it was one

[40:04] of the most extraordinary um

[40:07] relationships of my life one of the

[40:08] greatest loves of my life and when he

[40:11] showed up you know we knew pretty

[40:14] quickly that there was a great

[40:16] attraction and then we sat down and we

[40:18] had a conversation you know and and we

[40:21] said okay is this are you having this

[40:23] attraction I'm having it I started

[40:25] having dreams about this student and so

[40:27] what I I would do is I would do my

[40:29] practices and check in with myself and

[40:32] ask like what is this about you know am

[40:33] I projecting am I as the teacher

[40:36] projecting something because we often

[40:37] hear oh the projection coming onto us

[40:40] but there there's multiple directions of

[40:43] this and um as we're all you know in the

[40:48] purificatory fires of yoga you know

[40:51] teachers and students a lot comes to the

[40:53] surface and we're in a collective Shadow

[40:55] dance you know in a certain way too and

[40:58] so we have to keep bringing it back to

[41:00] ourselves and knowing ourselves so when

[41:03] this man and I we sat down and we talked

[41:05] and we had a very real and beautiful

[41:08] conversation and we chose that we would

[41:10] explore the relationship and so I said

[41:13] well if this is our choice then um I I

[41:17] really want to ask you to find other

[41:19] teachers because I don't want to be your

[41:21] teacher and your lover you know that's

[41:23] it it's just too much for me to consider

[41:26] so we just got really clear with it and

[41:30] I do not regret that choice that was one

[41:32] of the most gorgeous experiences of my

[41:35] life so I wouldn't want to take that

[41:36] away from anyone but I would just keep

[41:38] saying that we have to keep encouraging

[41:41] each other go to your practices you know

[41:45] eight limbs um your whatever you're

[41:48] committed to and dedicated to in your

[41:50] practices know your intention and really

[41:52] know it you know know it clearly know it

[41:55] fully not sort of guessing what your

[41:57] intention is or sort of halfway showing

[41:59] up but show up fully and start by

[42:01] showing up fully in yourself and then we

[42:04] can make really conscious skillful

[42:06] choices and that's what yoga is skillful

[42:09] choices in the world that's rooted from

[42:11] the ground of our being which is love

[42:13] which is recognition which is the pulse

[42:16] of the essence of life itself so I my I

[42:20] guess what I really want to say is every

[42:22] teacher and every student practice

[42:24] practice know yourself and have a mature

[42:27] beautiful skillful conversation and and

[42:29] make smart choices you know and and be

[42:32] accountable for what is your stuff you

[42:35] know and that includes the teachers and

[42:38] the students all of

[42:40] us and which makes complete I mean I

[42:43] totally agree and I I think I think

[42:45] we're all in agreement here that the

[42:47] that the main the thing is to shift the

[42:50] power I mean that it's very important

[42:51] that if it's if there's any kind of a

[42:53] student teacher relationship that

[42:55] develops Beyond just being

[42:58] fairly clear that it needs to that that

[43:00] Dynamic needs to shift first and I'm

[43:02] interested to note that it worked and

[43:04] I've seen it work with lots of teachers

[43:06] that I know who' have ended up you know

[43:07] not necessarily in long-term

[43:09] relationships but that it's been a

[43:11] mature and

[43:13] sustainable relationship from teacher to

[43:15] student but I'm also interested to know

[43:19] because I I definitely agree about it

[43:22] coming back to being your own clear

[43:24] mirror but at the same time I'm in

[43:27] interested in as a collective how we

[43:30] handle these issues and not just in in

[43:33] the sexual realm in just inow Dynamics

[43:36] when you see a teacher who you know they

[43:38] may not be hitting on their students or

[43:40] anything like that but you see them take

[43:43] taking their power in an inappropriate

[43:46] way in you know becoming an ego

[43:49] relationship instead of an actual fluid

[43:53] channeling relationship so I'm just

[43:55] curious to know if any of you here have

[43:56] had that had that experience with with a

[43:59] peer whether it's a teacher who teaches

[44:01] at your studio or a teacher that you

[44:03] teach with because I I think since since

[44:05] we are our own Collective group of

[44:09] ethicists as it were it's a difficult

[44:13] it's a difficult position to be in with

[44:15] your peers so see somebody else

[44:17] completely take advantage of their

[44:18] situation yeah and whatever that may be

[44:21] but and have how have you handled it

[44:23] like as a for me to observe a teacher

[44:25] taking advantage of another student

[44:26] situation

[44:28] um oh man oh I was going to say

[44:31] something else but

[44:34] now

[44:37] um you know I think that number one um

[44:40] you know it's me I personally when I

[44:43] when I come into the studio um call me a

[44:46] bit of a prude but I I enter the space

[44:48] and I really see it um I really diffuse

[44:51] any kind of um energy that might be

[44:55] considered sexual or anything Beyond um

[44:59] you know my role as a teacher I tell my

[45:01] teachers in my teacher training that

[45:02] number one teacher first before even

[45:06] being a friend teachership becomes um

[45:08] before friendship even so there's a

[45:10] certain I know right away for me I I can

[45:14] diffuse any energy that's coming at me

[45:17] from a weird funky angle um but in terms

[45:20] of actually observing another teacher

[45:23] getting involved it's it's tough if it's

[45:25] a really good friend of mine that I'm

[45:26] teaching with I might like you know be

[45:29] able to have a one-on-one and and and

[45:32] give them my insight but I mean

[45:35] ultimately what can you do I'm not going

[45:37] to I can't necessarily police the

[45:40] actions of my friends and and do you

[45:42] feel like it's not it's not your role I

[45:44] mean which is a totally valid answer I'm

[45:48] not looking for right or wrong at all I

[45:49] mean I don't even know what my opinion

[45:50] is necessarily but I'm curious to know

[45:53] you know are we each other's moral

[45:56] compass or are we you know do we not

[45:58] even with a friend but with yeah within

[46:01] our community sure I've been in classes

[46:03] where I've seen uh teachers

[46:05] inappropriately touch um and one of the

[46:07] fascinating things that you realize is

[46:10] they're not aware that they're doing it

[46:12] right they may they may touch and

[46:13] actually I saw a teacher recently who is

[46:16] probably one of the most sweetest Souls

[46:18] on the planet that you could ever meet

[46:20] and he was touching really lightly in an

[46:22] essential way only because he didn't

[46:24] want to disturb the students energy so

[46:26] he thought that was a way of respecting

[46:28] the student whereas the student may take

[46:31] that totally differently right and I saw

[46:34] it in a different way so I mean one of

[46:36] the things when I see that I mean most

[46:38] of the time when I go to a class or some

[46:40] the teacher will sometimes ask

[46:42] afterwards so you know what do you think

[46:44] or you know whatever um and in a

[46:46] situation like that I just hey you know

[46:48] uh maybe on the physical adjustments you

[46:51] could be a little bit more you know

[46:52] stronger with your hands or a little bit

[46:54] more precise in the way you touch

[46:56] someone and and a couple of times I've

[46:58] had that conversation oh because it

[47:00] looked like to me like it was it could

[47:02] be seen as sensual so just be careful

[47:05] with that and just do this and this you

[47:06] know um but it's not necessarily a sense

[47:09] of policing as it is is I know the guy's

[47:12] soul I know that guy and that's not his

[47:15] intention and so I mean and I've also

[47:18] been in classes where the teacher has

[47:20] that intention and I just you know it's

[47:23] not I didn't feel comfortable talking to

[47:26] the teacher about it instead you know I

[47:28] just didn't go back I'll what I just

[47:32] said um you know I've had some friends

[47:34] um when I was teaching elsewhere inste

[47:36] of Whistler where a student was giving

[47:39] them gifts like big money big money

[47:42] items like like literally like a a

[47:44] washing machine I need those students

[47:47] yeah like cloth started off with little

[47:49] little items like clothing and then um

[47:52] like tickets to concerts and it was

[47:55] really repetitive and it was becoming

[47:56] this uh from the outside in I I didn't

[47:59] receive any of these gifts but from the

[48:00] outside in I could see that it was very

[48:02] much the student wanting to

[48:06] somehow own or or have part of that

[48:10] teach own power Dynamic for sure so I

[48:12] did say something and that still didn't

[48:15] stop that teacher that collection of

[48:17] teachers that was rece that was they

[48:19] were all receiving these really big item

[48:21] gifts where to a point where I think

[48:22] there was actually a car involved yeah

[48:25] and so I I don't know I I don't know if

[48:28] that was actually if they actually took

[48:30] the car but um you knowjust

[48:33] were can we do a workshop on those

[48:35] adjustments but I I thought that this

[48:37] was incredibly inappropriate I right

[48:39] from the start even um I feel

[48:41] uncomfortable to a certain extent it's

[48:42] fine to from time to time if a student

[48:44] gives you a small gift or a token of of

[48:48] Love or they you know that's really

[48:49] sweet and I really take that with um

[48:51] kindness especially if a letter or

[48:53] something really from the heart but um

[48:55] that was an example where I did say

[48:57] something and it was still wasn't taken

[49:00] into consideration you know ultimately

[49:03] it's up to each individual to take

[49:05] responsibility for their own whatever

[49:07] they decide to do with their role as a

[49:09] teacher you can you

[49:11] know yeah I think I think our community

[49:14] is so in touch with each other I mean we

[49:17] have it's interesting because what's

[49:19] really happened in our world is Yoga has

[49:21] become really popular and so is the

[49:22] internet you know I think people are

[49:25] having these conversations a lot on the

[49:27] internet and not everyone's going to

[49:28] feel the same way CU I actually think

[49:30] that the goalposts are actually more

[49:33] shiftable than you may think I mean even

[49:35] in the eight limbs you know I used to

[49:37] date someone and she was like no it's

[49:39] all about cleanliness outa you know I'm

[49:40] like no no it's about if I mean like

[49:42] Brar I mean really would like there

[49:44] would be no dating at all exactly

[49:45] exactly like no it actually means no

[49:47] love no sex outside the relationship

[49:48] like no no it means it means actually no

[49:52] sex right and um you know so there's so

[49:54] much up for interpretation even within

[49:57] the eight limbs I think I really do but

[50:00] um and I think that what's kind of going

[50:02] on organically just really needs to step

[50:04] up cuz I really don't think we need a

[50:06] board to judge yoga ethics I mean I

[50:09] don't know how you feel but as yogis we

[50:11] check in with our bodies and I feel like

[50:14] oh we becoming one of them well

[50:16] ultimately the the on the I mean on the

[50:19] positive side I do feel like I think

[50:21] Chris you were alluding to this too is

[50:23] that these things do come out in the

[50:25] wash I mean it does it all comes around

[50:28] and because we are not the the small

[50:31] town Parish priest who's doing this or

[50:34] that or your Doctor Who or your

[50:36] psychotherapist who have it's PE you

[50:38] know your students always have the right

[50:39] to leave for whatever reason if they're

[50:41] getting a bad if if it's if there's a

[50:43] bad relationship anywhere and then

[50:45] eventually your studio or your community

[50:49] will resolve the issue and you know even

[50:52] if it's even if it's intensely painful

[50:54] and difficult the way it was with John I

[50:57] do feel like the community resolved the

[50:59] issue and it didn't need a board of

[51:01] Ethics it it it as difficult as it may

[51:04] have been it it made its way through its

[51:07] own system and you know I think that's

[51:10] the that's the really positive thing

[51:12] about an organism that is flexible and

[51:16] creative and self- responsible I guess I

[51:19] guess the point I want to quickly make

[51:21] and I'll then I'll stop talking about is

[51:24] that the role of the students to not

[51:27] give their power away you know because

[51:30] this is what we do continuously and um

[51:33] you know my friend Joel Kramer he talks

[51:34] you writes whole books about this but to

[51:37] not just give power away to people but

[51:40] to keep holding them accountable and I

[51:42] think that's the other part of it that

[51:43] needs to be educated is you know not

[51:46] just the role of the teachers but the

[51:47] role of the students well and that your

[51:49] role as a teacher ultimately is to teach

[51:52] the student that they are their own

[51:53] teacher and you are just a one of you

[51:56] are one particular conduit for whatever

[51:58] particular body of information you may

[52:00] be transmitting But ultimately this is

[52:02] the great thing about our tradition is

[52:06] that we are everyone is their own

[52:08] teacher ultimately they own their their

[52:10] own best teacher here here here here so

[52:13] um we have to wrap it up and I want to

[52:14] leave some time to take some questions

[52:16] from you guys um but I guess I want to

[52:19] um I want to end on uh a couple quick

[52:22] questions we'll just go down the line

[52:23] two questions the first is what is the

[52:27] um and if you just want to pass you can

[52:28] pass what is the a a a positive

[52:33] responsibility that you have as a

[52:36] teacher in in that you didn't expect

[52:38] that you were taking on when you first

[52:40] became a teacher what did you not yet

[52:43] know that you were going to have to

[52:47] embody as part of your teaching role and

[52:51] if you if you don't have an answer

[52:52] that's okay too this there's there's no

[52:54] you won't we won't make you stay

[52:59] so for me one of the most positive

[53:00] things that I've really been stepping

[53:02] into especially this year is just the

[53:05] the shifting of My reality that

[53:07] difficult situations difficult students

[53:10] are not I I haven't painted them as good

[53:13] or bad I'm really just taking on these

[53:16] these things as um an ability for me to

[53:18] sharpen my tools and I want to do a lot

[53:20] of really big beautiful things in the

[53:21] world so being able to um recognize and

[53:25] realize that when there are are really

[53:28] daunting things that are in front of me

[53:31] being able to take a breath and know

[53:32] that these things are here to affirm who

[53:35] I am and to give me tools that will

[53:37] support my students so that's been a

[53:39] really positive thing that I hadn't seen

[53:41] coming and it's uh it's a good year to

[53:43] be practicing that way in my experience

[53:45] it's been a lot that's been shifting and

[53:48] um yeah

[53:51] good I wasn't aware that people excuse

[53:54] me would actually listen to me

[53:59] and and the biggest the biggest thing

[54:03] I've learned about that is to Simply

[54:05] only

[54:06] teach from my own experience because if

[54:09] I'm teaching from any other place then

[54:13] they're listening to something that

[54:15] isn't that isn't true and now that I've

[54:18] learned that they actually do listen to

[54:19] me I do that much much more in my

[54:21] planning of my classes and any teaching

[54:24] that I offer and make sure that it's

[54:26] something that I've

[54:28] experienced and that resonates with

[54:32] me

[54:36] yeah I I wasn't quite prepared for you

[54:40] know all the agulation and praise you

[54:43] that would come with the territory and

[54:44] along with that you know the the blame

[54:48] as well it's it's very babat Gita you

[54:51] know um the praise and the blame kind of

[54:54] come hand in hand and two sides of the

[54:56] the same coin so as I deepened into

[55:02] teaching and going there you know

[55:03] there's so much that comes and you have

[55:05] to field it and it's so easy to want to

[55:09] say yes to the praise and like thank you

[55:11] thank you and then when the other thing

[55:13] comes you know oh I didn't like the way

[55:15] you said that or did that or you did

[55:17] this it's very you know that's more

[55:19] difficult to receive so I think one of

[55:22] the greatest Integrations really that

[55:27] has been happening and will always

[55:28] continue is that I get out of my own way

[55:33] and allow the experience to unfold you

[55:37] know for each person's journey and then

[55:40] ultimately um I know that I'm a

[55:43] facilitator of a facilitator of safe

[55:47] space that people can tap into

[55:49] themselves and they might have to go

[55:51] through all sorts of stories where maybe

[55:53] I'm the one that they think for it or

[55:55] the one that they are not you know

[55:57] feeling so grateful to at the moment but

[56:00] that I have to get out of my own way for

[56:03] to be that clear conduit and channel and

[56:06] that's the practice all the time and you

[56:09] know one of the ways I think of

[56:10] brahmacharya actually since that word's

[56:12] been brought

[56:14] up okay so we go of celibacy you know

[56:17] this this um view of it but I also look

[56:20] at it as the acharia is the one who

[56:22] walks the one who walks the path of

[56:25] Brahma and Brahma meaning like the

[56:27] universal so uh walking the path of

[56:31] cultivating a continual remembrance of

[56:34] the bigger flow of what's actually

[56:35] happening and that I am doing the best I

[56:39] can in this human body and with the gift

[56:42] of my voice in my particular way of

[56:44] expressing these teachings But

[56:46] ultimately the the you know I'm being

[56:50] I'm a servant of the shocky and I am

[56:53] going to do my best to remain in that

[56:55] flow and to walk that

[57:00] path

[57:02] um what she

[57:05] said no I mean for real what she

[57:09] said I think for me um one of the things

[57:12] I wasn't prepared for is um not being

[57:16] able to turn teacher off like uh those

[57:19] of you guys I mean travel

[57:20] internationally you spend a lot of time

[57:22] um with students outside of class as

[57:24] well so you are always is um in one

[57:28] sense elevated but you're you're

[57:30] literally called to be your higher self

[57:32] all the time you know there's been many

[57:34] times where you know I've been in

[57:37] traffic and I'm ready to flip a finger

[57:39] out the window somebody will pull up

[57:41] alongside me and go hey I was in your

[57:43] class last week you know so you know is

[57:46] is that is you know and and and I'm

[57:50] human right I'm human but also to

[57:52] recognize it is that now what's being

[57:55] called to me is to be

[57:57] the best self that I can be all the time

[58:01] which then is self inquiry to go within

[58:03] and say what is that self where is my

[58:05] Truth where is it coming from and then

[58:07] do the best that I can to act from that

[58:09] space is it going to be perfect no

[58:11] absolutely not my wife will tell you

[58:12] that but um but as long as I think as

[58:16] we're doing the best that we can and we

[58:18] are checking into our hearts and saying

[58:20] where's this coming from why am I doing

[58:22] this and and just keep coming from that

[58:24] space and keep sharing from that space

[58:26] and I think it it'll all work out and so

[58:29] would you say that

[58:31] um at go in that shift from from student

[58:34] to teacher you were forced to live your

[58:38] yoga more this is where you're

[58:40] absolutely 100% yeah and and that that

[58:43] for me now it doesn't feel like it ever

[58:45] turns off um and and and sometimes it's

[58:49] exhausting and then sometimes it's it's

[58:51] a reaffirmation that I'm doing what I'm

[58:53] supposed to be doing so when I step into

[58:56] it it's awesome when I fight it it

[58:59] sucks with

[59:01] that I would agree with Chris that that

[59:03] I wasn't expecting um you know when I

[59:06] amped up my teaching and especially

[59:08] doing teacher trainings and then living

[59:09] in a small town and um you know being in

[59:13] the you know grocery grocery store

[59:15] lineup and bumping into all my students

[59:17] and then that same night going out to

[59:19] the you know the bar with a friend and

[59:21] you know the friend passes me her drink

[59:24] and then her cigarette to hold then I'm

[59:25] standing out on the IO and it's like my

[59:28] certain the the duty of a yeah as a

[59:31] teacher/ student and uh it yeah and one

[59:34] way it has made me a better person but

[59:37] to also if I feel like flipping the bird

[59:40] and if I feel like having a drag of

[59:42] their

[59:43] cigarette I should be okay with that and

[59:45] I shouldn't have to explain myself

[59:47] because again we're all human and none

[59:49] of us are Buddhas and none of us are

[59:51] perfect but let me bring let me just

[59:53] bring it back around to to um to my

[59:55] initial question which was which is not

[59:58] unrelated to to to this issue of of who

[1:00:01] you are and who you become because of

[1:00:03] the the path that we on as teachers but

[1:00:06] um I'm interested in as in what you feel

[1:00:11] like what you were what you didn't

[1:00:13] expect that your responsibilities would

[1:00:15] contain how how

[1:00:18] encompassing your job would be does that

[1:00:21] make any

[1:00:23] sense like I mean I know for myself I I

[1:00:27] I very much started teaching as an aena

[1:00:30] teacher I mean that's really where I was

[1:00:32] coming from I'm about to bring people

[1:00:34] into their bodies so that they felt

[1:00:35] better in their bodies so they could be

[1:00:38] better people simply because they felt

[1:00:40] better in their bodies very much where I

[1:00:42] was practicing from and where I started

[1:00:44] teaching from and then I was very

[1:00:46] surprised at how quickly

[1:00:49] I people expected me to be responsible

[1:00:53] for their heart and their health their

[1:00:56] larger health and their soul and so

[1:00:58] because they expected that then I had to

[1:01:01] step up to the plate as best I could

[1:01:04] which was awesome and awful all at the

[1:01:06] you know at the same time but I'm I'm

[1:01:09] just curious to know on the um because

[1:01:12] the the negative sides the the barriers

[1:01:14] are are pretty obvious and have been

[1:01:16] hashed out a lot but I also think

[1:01:19] there's this amazing elevation and Grace

[1:01:22] that comes with being put in a position

[1:01:25] to help help people help themselves and

[1:01:29] um so I'm just interested in in in your

[1:01:31] own in all of your personal experience

[1:01:34] where that beautiful opening

[1:01:38] happens um in in what's like could be is

[1:01:43] it could be seen negatively as a as a

[1:01:45] power sharing relationship but that's

[1:01:47] the it's the lovely part of the really

[1:01:49] lovely part of the of the student

[1:01:51] teacher relationship which we all know

[1:01:53] is is the the greatest the most of it is

[1:01:56] this amazing exchange otherwise we

[1:01:58] wouldn't all be participating in it um

[1:02:01] does that make any sense

[1:02:03] yeah I think as a i to I totally get

[1:02:07] what you're saying and but I think also

[1:02:09] it's to not get too overwhelmed or um uh

[1:02:14] you know if if a student is

[1:02:19] um I guess like when when if a student

[1:02:22] comes to me and they have uh like a

[1:02:23] matter of the heart I'm there to listen

[1:02:26] and to hold space but I'm not going to

[1:02:28] get too overly involved or too connected

[1:02:33] or too attached to what their life

[1:02:36] experience may be so if um there's a

[1:02:39] certain um kind of I don't know there's

[1:02:42] a certain diffusing that I do as a

[1:02:44] teacher um where it's I'll I'll be a

[1:02:47] part of that process and I'll listen and

[1:02:48] I'll be more a space holder than

[1:02:51] anything and I think that as soon as I

[1:02:53] go home and think my God I'm all this

[1:02:56] and this person is coming to me with all

[1:02:58] their stuff then then it becomes a big

[1:03:00] thing when I make it a big thing then it

[1:03:02] becomes a big thing but if I if I'm just

[1:03:05] there as as a part of their experience

[1:03:08] like in a as a as a circle and their

[1:03:10] growth much was saying about being a

[1:03:13] part of the reflection yeah and I think

[1:03:15] that there's just got to be like a like

[1:03:16] a a almost a tacit understanding between

[1:03:19] teacher and student that I'm not their

[1:03:22] psychotherapist I'm not their

[1:03:24] physiotherapist I'm not their their

[1:03:26] certain Prof like professional roles

[1:03:28] that we as as yoga instructors try to

[1:03:31] take on and it's it's just too much like

[1:03:33] the weight of the world at the end of

[1:03:35] the day yeah we're create we're creating

[1:03:37] a beautiful experience for them on the

[1:03:38] mat we

[1:03:40] establish sometimes um the odd

[1:03:42] relationship like uh that is special

[1:03:45] like Sienna was saying her experience

[1:03:47] with her five-year relationship and

[1:03:49] that's I think that's really special but

[1:03:51] that's also unique um you know when I

[1:03:53] enter the the classroom again I don't

[1:03:56] ENT it and see it as a as a dating pool

[1:03:58] I see it as an experience where I'm

[1:03:59] going to be teaching people what I know

[1:04:02] to the best of my ability and um

[1:04:06] yeah I kind of went off in Tangent there

[1:04:11] but um actually my background is a

[1:04:14] little bit different because I got into

[1:04:16] yoga through philosophy my um I got into

[1:04:19] philosophy because my inspiration when I

[1:04:21] was in high school was Joseph Campbell

[1:04:23] and he said follow your bliss and the

[1:04:25] second part of that is follow your bliss

[1:04:26] and where once there were walls soon

[1:04:29] there will be doors and um so I thought

[1:04:32] about it long and hard I'm like what is

[1:04:34] my Bliss and and similar to what

[1:04:36] everyone's expressed here and when I've

[1:04:37] said already my Bliss is actually being

[1:04:39] a conduit for love um so I wented to

[1:04:41] study philosophy which is how I got into

[1:04:44] yoga philosophy and Eastern religions

[1:04:46] and meditation yoga um and then my

[1:04:49] original goal was to be a professor of

[1:04:52] the philosophy of love I mean check that

[1:04:55] out for a re a

[1:04:58] powder and uh and actually yoga came

[1:05:01] afterwards the physical yoga practice I

[1:05:02] never thought I could teach yoga because

[1:05:04] um I was so tight I mean I was a extreme

[1:05:07] sport athlete and um it just came so

[1:05:10] easily to so many people I'm like Oh my

[1:05:12] go and then it took me a lot of

[1:05:13] confidence to be like oh if I can just

[1:05:15] get true on this love message that

[1:05:17] doesn't matter about how physically

[1:05:19] adapt you are um so where I wanted to go

[1:05:22] with this is what that I knew I I

[1:05:25] understood the Campbell message of like

[1:05:27] follow your bliss and things are going

[1:05:28] to somehow work out what I didn't know

[1:05:31] is the what I call now the Ganesha

[1:05:33] principle which is tied in with when I

[1:05:36] surf the Whitewater principle what I

[1:05:38] mean is it the doors just don't

[1:05:41] open um that there's obstacles that are

[1:05:44] always put in your way um so from day

[1:05:48] one when I first started teaching yoga

[1:05:50] in Vancouver there was only one other

[1:05:52] Yoga Studio in Vancouver and there was

[1:05:54] just a kind of handful of yoga teachers

[1:05:55] I'm like I I know the city is ripe for

[1:05:57] yoga um and and so I started renting a

[1:06:01] space and teaching yoga and no one

[1:06:03] showed up no one I mean for two months

[1:06:07] right no one and I'm like I know I'm

[1:06:09] ready to do this I know it's my mission

[1:06:11] and and to me I look at that now and go

[1:06:13] that was Ganesha saying to

[1:06:16] me why are you doing what you're doing

[1:06:18] and are you willing to do what you're

[1:06:20] doing for

[1:06:21] free are you willing to actually pay

[1:06:23] money to do this cuz that's what it

[1:06:25] amounted to I was renting into space and

[1:06:26] not having anyone come right and and in

[1:06:30] surfing you know I'm a surfer I looked

[1:06:32] at this and everyone looks at pictures

[1:06:34] of Surfing you watch Surf Videos you're

[1:06:36] like oh my God those guys just ride

[1:06:37] waves all day but mostly what you do is

[1:06:39] paddle right and you got to go through

[1:06:42] this white water and sometimes it's

[1:06:43] terrifying you mean you look at these

[1:06:45] massive waves and you got to somehow go

[1:06:47] under it and to me that's Ganesha in the

[1:06:49] water right and it's the same thing this

[1:06:52] Ganesha principle makes you go why am I

[1:06:55] doing what I'm doing doing I mean why am

[1:06:57] I not just sitting on the beach having a

[1:06:59] margarita with everyone else on the lawn

[1:07:00] chair right and and what will happen if

[1:07:03] I can align my passions with the outer

[1:07:06] world and um and and Magic happens when

[1:07:08] you get out there and that's what I

[1:07:10] really learned is just this whole

[1:07:12] Ganesha principle and what a gift these

[1:07:15] obstacles really are and what a chance

[1:07:18] this really is to learn and thinking

[1:07:20] about the larger context of our

[1:07:21] conversation it does tie in because I

[1:07:23] feel like you know there's a reason why

[1:07:25] we're all having this convers ation and

[1:07:27] I feel like this whole thing is one big

[1:07:30] obstacle in front of a lot of people and

[1:07:33] it's making us really get clear and it's

[1:07:35] a big blessing Underneath It All and

[1:07:37] we're so fortunate to have it so um I

[1:07:40] hope we can um you know be be not just

[1:07:44] mirrors for each other but support

[1:07:46] systems because you're right we're out

[1:07:47] to

[1:07:48] see we're paddling around and and and

[1:07:50] there's currents pulling us every which

[1:07:52] way and we're not giving a map we're

[1:07:54] just trying to figure it out and so we

[1:07:56] actually need our community to go hey

[1:07:58] how about this how about that and and

[1:08:00] this didn't really work or and you might

[1:08:02] have to justify and then we go oh okay I

[1:08:04] get it right um so these obstacles are

[1:08:07] are beautiful and that's what I really

[1:08:08] learned is that and it and it and it is

[1:08:11] our gift in front of us now with this

[1:08:14] conversation good we put okay so I think

[1:08:18] we'll open the floor up for about 10

[1:08:20] minutes of questions if anyone has any

[1:08:23] yeah hello I'd like to ask the panel

[1:08:25] where they see yoga in 100 years from

[1:08:28] now both in terms of the teacher student

[1:08:32] relationship and any rules or

[1:08:34] regulations that I personally would

[1:08:36] regret being

[1:08:39] introduced

[1:08:41] 100 I think it's coming but it won't be

[1:08:43] our

[1:08:44] [Laughter]

[1:08:48] concern so I feel like um something that

[1:08:51] I saw in Jamaica that really just moved

[1:08:53] me is this group called yoga angel ual

[1:08:56] and they teach children how to teach

[1:08:58] other children yoga and there's just so

[1:09:00] much about certification and you have to

[1:09:03] do it this way and this is right yoga

[1:09:05] and this is wrong yoga and I see a big

[1:09:08] trend of people in the Parks sharing the

[1:09:11] love of movement sharing the love of

[1:09:12] yoga and um it's never going to take

[1:09:15] away from what it is to study from a

[1:09:17] really rich lineage of people that have

[1:09:20] tremendous knowledge that have traveled

[1:09:21] the world and there's something really

[1:09:23] beautiful about transmission um based

[1:09:26] yoga so I feel like in a 100 years I

[1:09:29] think that the the pyramid will keep

[1:09:30] climbing there'll be teachers that know

[1:09:32] even more and have gone even deeper in

[1:09:34] their practices but there's going to be

[1:09:36] a huge Foundation of people that are

[1:09:38] willing and able to share their joy for

[1:09:40] yoga with their grandma with their

[1:09:42] friends with with everybody that's

[1:09:45] that's my vision my

[1:09:47] hope hope you

[1:09:50] read um I hope that it's uh officially

[1:09:54] allowed in

[1:09:56] hospitals and like settings like uh I

[1:09:59] mean it already is it officially allowed

[1:10:02] in hospitals or is it you know like like

[1:10:04] an actual like to be able to have like a

[1:10:06] yoga therapist come into like is it do

[1:10:09] that happen now maybe in

[1:10:11] Canada okay then they in a really like

[1:10:15] modern modern hospital but you can't

[1:10:18] wear those gowns cuz in downward

[1:10:23] do um and also I think what you see up

[1:10:26] here is you see a lot of people that are

[1:10:28] following their truth and and doing the

[1:10:30] best to bring that out in the world and

[1:10:33] I think uh yoga will come off the mat

[1:10:36] and it's going to start to spread into

[1:10:38] areas of society where people are just

[1:10:40] really encouraged by people like this to

[1:10:43] do what you love and do it in a in a and

[1:10:46] in doing so it becomes a spiritual act

[1:10:49] and I think I think we're going back

[1:10:51] that way so I think it's awesome and I I

[1:10:54] see the integration you know so on the

[1:10:57] mat off the mat and the integration of

[1:11:00] all the practices of yoga um once more

[1:11:05] coming into a flourishing place um

[1:11:09] inside the practices so the ASA is very

[1:11:13] prevalent for many people and it's great

[1:11:16] because Asa just breaks you open it it

[1:11:19] cracks you open and you students are so

[1:11:24] much more willing to explore

[1:11:26] everything that yoga has to offer so I

[1:11:28] see yoga coming into the hearts of so

[1:11:32] many um in this integrated way and

[1:11:35] meditators all over the planet and I

[1:11:38] think that that would be an outrageous

[1:11:42] Act of yoga for as many people as

[1:11:45] possible to be deeply meditating and

[1:11:48] studying and living in as harmonious

[1:11:51] ways as possible with the planet and

[1:11:53] with each other actually can I answer

[1:11:55] this exactly and I I think that um I

[1:11:58] hate to say it but I think we're going

[1:12:00] to have a board I think we're going to

[1:12:02] have a yoga ethics board and it deflates

[1:12:05] me to see it but I think it's coming I

[1:12:08] think so because okay if if if if it

[1:12:12] keeps getting if the popularity Trend

[1:12:14] keeps going I mean this is the whole

[1:12:16] thing is we're lucky right now that we

[1:12:18] can be our own mirrors as we keep

[1:12:19] talking about I you know it's it's it's

[1:12:21] a it's a real Heyday you know uh it's

[1:12:24] we're we're lucky to live live in this

[1:12:26] period where at least we can um decide

[1:12:29] what's uh works for us or not um but as

[1:12:34] anything gets bigger it's like it gets

[1:12:37] codified and if the you know basically

[1:12:41] think that's the point that it'll

[1:12:43] transform I hope it doesn't you know I

[1:12:45] think this is the big beautiful thing

[1:12:46] that we've got going on in the yoga I

[1:12:48] hope it doesn't but uh human nature

[1:12:50] Being Human Nature I mean tell me uh you

[1:12:53] know okay here here it is is that um you

[1:12:55] we're we're trying to work this out and

[1:12:56] you know all of us all of us everyone

[1:13:00] partaking listening to this conversation

[1:13:01] is trying to work it out and that's a

[1:13:03] beautiful thing but

[1:13:06] uh it's it's it's difficult and I and I

[1:13:09] I I just look at so many other things I

[1:13:12] mean I think we're Mystics you know I

[1:13:14] hear a lot of mystical thing and the

[1:13:15] thing about Mystics versus religions is

[1:13:17] that religions live in answers and

[1:13:20] Mystics live in qu in questions right

[1:13:23] and we're trying to live in questions is

[1:13:24] this right is this not right does this

[1:13:26] feel good does this not feel good but um

[1:13:28] you know it's if I look at try and name

[1:13:31] to me anything outside of this yoga

[1:13:34] realm that is still I mean I don't know

[1:13:37] you know you tweet something wrong in

[1:13:38] the Olympics and you get kicked out

[1:13:40] right I mean there's everything has a

[1:13:41] governing body right and you know who

[1:13:44] thought we were going to have a a

[1:13:46] standard for yoga teachers trainings you

[1:13:48] know for what it is to have a 500 hour

[1:13:50] yoga teacher training that used to be

[1:13:52] that used to be um you know not long ago

[1:13:55] 5 10 years ago that was just hey you you

[1:13:58] you can work that out but now we have

[1:14:00] kind of actually I mean it's toothless I

[1:14:03] mean really but and this is this is off

[1:14:05] topic but I do think it totally relates

[1:14:08] and and I mean I don't disagree with you

[1:14:10] but I hope you're wrong I hope I'm wrong

[1:14:12] too I hope I'm wrong too believe me no I

[1:14:14] know you do and but it only will happen

[1:14:16] if enough people capitulate and the end

[1:14:20] the yoga teacher like that it's really

[1:14:23] it's a it's a it's a sham organization I

[1:14:27] mean you know not I mean not to say that

[1:14:29] there isn't any I mean it only exists

[1:14:31] because the larger Community has agreed

[1:14:35] more or less that we

[1:14:37] need we need some sort of structure to

[1:14:41] say what is and what isn't but it

[1:14:43] isn't it isn't any more than our

[1:14:46] collective decision that the yoga

[1:14:48] Alliance means something does that make

[1:14:50] any sense if we had an Ethics board that

[1:14:53] was no more than that I think it's

[1:14:54] something that people could live with if

[1:14:56] it became something that was actually

[1:14:59] governed on high that's something else

[1:15:02] entirely and believe me the state is

[1:15:05] trying to get in on it right I mean this

[1:15:07] in the same way that the state is the

[1:15:08] state I don't know if it's happening in

[1:15:10] all states but in New York in two years

[1:15:11] ago the state tried to come in and

[1:15:14] govern yoga teacher trainings so the

[1:15:16] yoga Alliance is it's it's our own

[1:15:17] community's basic collective decision to

[1:15:20] have a governing body but if New York

[1:15:23] State came in in the same way that they

[1:15:25] regulate

[1:15:26] massage if they came in and they

[1:15:29] regulate our our teacher trainings and

[1:15:32] then come to regulate our whole industry

[1:15:35] that will be when an Ethics panel gets

[1:15:39] established by by an outside body does

[1:15:42] that make sense and we it was fought by

[1:15:45] all of the small studios in New York

[1:15:47] that said absolutely no we don't want

[1:15:49] the state governing and that's going to

[1:15:51] have to happen Community by community

[1:15:53] and state by state

[1:15:55] on all of those levels if we do not want

[1:15:58] our industry to be co-opted and what we

[1:16:01] are is we are a huge collection of

[1:16:03] cottage industries right now and if we

[1:16:05] want to keep it that way it's that as

[1:16:08] cottage industries we come together and

[1:16:09] we say no we don't we don't we don't

[1:16:11] want actually a governing body we want

[1:16:13] to be a collective anyway that went way

[1:16:16] off topic

[1:16:18] um um anyway

[1:16:22] yes hi um so I have a comment and a

[1:16:25] question my comment is um that like

[1:16:28] Chris I come into this community

[1:16:31] primarily in studentship but I do have

[1:16:33] another life uh as a professor in a

[1:16:36] university and one of the things that

[1:16:38] strikes me about the yoga Community when

[1:16:40] they start talking about ethics and

[1:16:42] boundaries is that they think there's

[1:16:43] something very special about being a

[1:16:45] yoga teacher and you wouldn't have

[1:16:48] thought that someone whose job it was to

[1:16:50] teach 17th century British poetry would

[1:16:53] have had to learn all the very same

[1:16:55] things that you say you've had to learn

[1:16:57] Skylar I have to talk to students about

[1:16:59] their own cancers I have to talk to

[1:17:00] students about their dying parents about

[1:17:02] their pregnancies so my wish for the

[1:17:05] yoga Community especially in matters of

[1:17:07] ethics and boundaries is that they would

[1:17:09] learn from other communities of teachers

[1:17:12] I never hear anyone in the yoga

[1:17:13] Community talk about talking to teachers

[1:17:16] in communities that have very very well

[1:17:19] developed and sophisticated

[1:17:21] conversations about sexual ethics we do

[1:17:24] have rules and guidelines but we also

[1:17:26] have a kind of um welldeveloped way of

[1:17:31] thinking and talking about these things

[1:17:32] that I feel like is so nent it's so new

[1:17:35] in the yoga Community it kind of blows

[1:17:37] me away so I think in response to what

[1:17:39] you said Ian I want to say you're

[1:17:41] actually not at Sea you're not out in

[1:17:43] the middle of nowhere every great art

[1:17:46] and practice in this world has teachers

[1:17:49] and every long-standing community of

[1:17:50] teachers has come up against issues of

[1:17:52] ethics and boundaries because teaching

[1:17:54] is a poorest way to choose to spend your

[1:17:57] life I'm curious to know your opinion

[1:18:00] though do you feel like those um and I

[1:18:03] ABS I completely agree with you and I

[1:18:05] don't think that I don't think that um

[1:18:08] that the yoga Community is actually

[1:18:09] operating in in a bubble that doesn't

[1:18:12] think that these there aren't all of

[1:18:13] these kind of rules out there and in the

[1:18:15] same way that I say that there is this

[1:18:17] funny relationship between being a a

[1:18:21] professor or being a doctor or being a

[1:18:23] psychotherapist I mean all of these all

[1:18:25] of these do but I think the point I'm

[1:18:27] trying to make is about teaching and

[1:18:29] that's why when when people have the

[1:18:31] conversation about what's the difference

[1:18:32] between a yoga teacher and a rockstar

[1:18:34] invariably they start talking to you

[1:18:36] about yoga and I want to say the

[1:18:37] difference between a yoga teacher and a

[1:18:39] rock star is that a yoga teacher is a

[1:18:40] teacher yes I would agree that's what

[1:18:43] makes the difference it's a slightly

[1:18:45] different kind of teacher I would say I

[1:18:48] would I mean I I I there in the in the

[1:18:51] power

[1:18:52] Dynamic relationship and navigating

[1:18:55] those

[1:18:55] those murky waters I agree that that

[1:18:58] that's inherent in any student teacher

[1:19:00] relationship and I agree with you that

[1:19:01] those those are these are issues that

[1:19:03] have been hashed out in the academic

[1:19:05] world and resolved to some extent and to

[1:19:07] some extent are always being rehashed

[1:19:10] but I think that there is something that

[1:19:14] is

[1:19:15] [Music]

[1:19:17] um inherent

[1:19:19] to what happens in a yoga class that's

[1:19:23] different than what happens in art

[1:19:25] history class look at what you're

[1:19:28] wearing number one um but you know what

[1:19:30] I'm saying I mean I do feel like there's

[1:19:32] an there's an intimacy and there's

[1:19:35] a there are boundaries that are bust

[1:19:39] open

[1:19:41] emotionally

[1:19:42] erotically

[1:19:44] psychologically that that happen in yoga

[1:19:47] classes all the time that aren't

[1:19:49] happening on a regular basis

[1:19:52] academically I don't know I have to say

[1:19:53] after 20 years at least in the

[1:19:55] humanities I would have to disagree with

[1:19:57] you I mean I watch students taught by

[1:20:00] great and the better the humanities

[1:20:01] teacher and I I can't speak to the

[1:20:03] Sciences the better the humity teacher

[1:20:05] the more the student has the experience

[1:20:07] of being worked over from the inside out

[1:20:10] in a way that we would really resonate

[1:20:13] with I think what you mean we just don't

[1:20:14] touch them I think what you mean by

[1:20:16] better is more passionate right like

[1:20:18] more yeah or something I mean I don't

[1:20:21] know what it is all I'm saying is that

[1:20:22] that cuz what you're saying about our

[1:20:23] history teacher I mean if art history

[1:20:25] teacher really wears their heart on

[1:20:27] their sleeve I think they'll have lots

[1:20:29] of people who are attracted to them

[1:20:31] versus saying things by wrote and just

[1:20:34] you know repeating the same notes that

[1:20:36] they just repeated last semester but

[1:20:38] it's also great training I mean I know

[1:20:40] that we feel as yoga teachers that we're

[1:20:42] responsible for the whole being but it's

[1:20:44] also been really great training and I

[1:20:46] feel like you really spoke to this Julia

[1:20:48] in being a good listener and then saying

[1:20:50] to my students and that is not my

[1:20:52] department you know that is not and

[1:20:54] here's who to speak to or to go to if

[1:20:56] you want but you know I will hear you

[1:20:58] but it is absolutely I don't feel

[1:21:01] responsible for taking care of part in

[1:21:03] either of my lives as a yoga teacher or

[1:21:05] when I was a mountaineering instructor

[1:21:06] before I was an English Professor I also

[1:21:08] wanted to do that I think I I'm really

[1:21:10] nodding a lot over here because I come

[1:21:12] from a family of teachers I come from a

[1:21:14] mom and a dad are teachers and my

[1:21:16] sister's a a a teacher now a principal

[1:21:19] so I grew up in a teaching community and

[1:21:21] I grew up with um watching and observing

[1:21:24] my par parents teaching and help um in

[1:21:27] very sticky situations maybe not

[1:21:29] necessarily um impassioned ones like

[1:21:31] we're speaking of but um really really

[1:21:34] angry parents or um um you know just a

[1:21:37] lot of situations my parents were thrown

[1:21:39] into the fire quite a bit as teachers

[1:21:41] and I honor School teachers whooo I like

[1:21:44] have so much respect for school teachers

[1:21:46] completely underpaid profession if you

[1:21:48] ask me but um but I think through

[1:21:51] observation of just watching my mom my

[1:21:53] mom was like my number one teacher and I

[1:21:56] just watched her listen more than

[1:21:57] anything she was an active listener but

[1:22:00] was still able to give out quite a bit

[1:22:02] of love and um and had such great love

[1:22:06] from her her community of students so um

[1:22:09] yeah I think that ultimately it's our

[1:22:11] choice it's our inner Choice as a

[1:22:13] teacher to decide um do I get swept up

[1:22:16] in this moment or do I um just just hold

[1:22:20] the space and and be here for this

[1:22:22] person in in a kind and um but

[1:22:25] professional way and I think yeah I

[1:22:28] think this I think this circles back to

[1:22:32] what I was saying about you teachers now

[1:22:36] not not professors but School teachers

[1:22:39] in the public school system can't put a

[1:22:40] Band-Aid on a student because I mean it

[1:22:43] that's taking that's taking the logic of

[1:22:48] of controlling and creating rules and

[1:22:51] ethics and boundaries so far and so far

[1:22:55] away from where I think we all agree

[1:22:57] that we want to be as a community that

[1:22:59] we would so I mean I think we would

[1:23:01] agree that we would so much rather

[1:23:02] suffer the pitfalls of there being

[1:23:05] people who go go over the boundary or do

[1:23:09] something inappropriate and that that

[1:23:11] are that it will it will be resolved

[1:23:14] with it within ourselves in in in in a

[1:23:16] in maybe a messy way so much better that

[1:23:19] than there are being rules about how

[1:23:21] exactly you can adjust a student I mean

[1:23:24] that's this this not really speaking to

[1:23:25] what you're saying but I mean I I agree

[1:23:27] but I but I also am very glad that we're

[1:23:30] not in the academic world where it's

[1:23:32] like you'll get fired you will lose

[1:23:33] tenure if you date a your student in

[1:23:36] some places you know and I I I'm glad

[1:23:39] that we're not in that I'm glad we're

[1:23:41] not in that in a structure like that

[1:23:43] personally yeah and and actually the

[1:23:45] academic world is moving away from that

[1:23:47] into into more nuanced I mean that's

[1:23:49] what I mean when I say the conversation

[1:23:50] is the conversation is happening the

[1:23:52] conversation that you are yearning for

[1:23:54] is happening

[1:23:55] and you know we could do I I think all I

[1:23:57] wanted to say is we could do a better

[1:23:59] job of actually talking to people in

[1:24:01] other fields who thought these things

[1:24:03] for a lot longer we always talk about

[1:24:05] like this is such a new problem for us

[1:24:06] and it's like well you know well it's

[1:24:08] the oldest it's the oldest problem I

[1:24:10] mean just read the Bible or anything

[1:24:13] or so anyway yes I I wasn't trying to

[1:24:16] say when we're out at Sea that we're

[1:24:17] thinking that we're the only people have

[1:24:19] his problems cuz yeah exactly what you

[1:24:21] said it happens in music it's it's and

[1:24:24] and I salute all teachers I mean you're

[1:24:26] just inspiring people and we want to

[1:24:28] learn from you yeah we're totally open

[1:24:30] into having conversations with other

[1:24:32] disciplines and as yoga teachers we are

[1:24:34] multifaceted beings so we are teachers

[1:24:37] some of us do Kyon we turn into rock

[1:24:40] stars some of us you know we have so our

[1:24:43] massage therapists so all these

[1:24:45] different fields that have dealt with

[1:24:47] these things I think it is smart to look

[1:24:49] at what what does the law say about a

[1:24:50] massage therapist what does the law say

[1:24:52] about um a scientist or a professor and

[1:24:55] I think there is a lot of wisdom and

[1:24:57] again we are multifaceted creatures that

[1:24:59] find hundreds of ways into students

[1:25:02] hearts and I come back for me to

[1:25:04] sustainability if if people are making

[1:25:07] the same mistake again and again and

[1:25:08] again it's our opportunity as community

[1:25:11] members to be like yo this is not

[1:25:13] looking good this is not feeling good

[1:25:15] why why is this happening again so I

[1:25:17] think that Community is is one answer

[1:25:20] not necessarily rigid rules but also

[1:25:21] just knowing that um you know this comes

[1:25:23] from the movie spider- man with great

[1:25:25] power comes great

[1:25:27] responsibility this is real and the more

[1:25:29] yoga you do the more powerful you become

[1:25:32] the more people you can touch the the

[1:25:34] more that you'll need the support of

[1:25:35] your peers because people can get really

[1:25:38] drunk on Power and it's really important

[1:25:39] to as we all rise each other up that

[1:25:42] there is the the potential that we can

[1:25:44] say Hey you know tone it down a little

[1:25:46] bit here sober up a little bit because

[1:25:48] it is people people can have a really

[1:25:50] good relationship with alcohol people

[1:25:51] can know exactly how to use it some

[1:25:53] people have really bad relationships and

[1:25:55] I think that power is is something that

[1:25:57] people can get drunk on and um you know

[1:26:00] can I just leverage off that a little

[1:26:01] bit I mean because I think we know all

[1:26:03] know the issue that we're you know

[1:26:05] talking about and and to me it was like

[1:26:07] um to just to bring it back to that

[1:26:09] topic and

[1:26:11] uh I wasn't surprised at all what

[1:26:14] happened in the anusara community I mean

[1:26:16] it didn't I'm I'm I've never been to an

[1:26:19] anusar yoga class in my life I'm one of

[1:26:20] the few people in the planet but I was

[1:26:22] always talking to people

[1:26:25] um about and that was my big thing is

[1:26:27] like how can you give up so much power

[1:26:30] to the system right cuz when I saw about

[1:26:33] anara I was like looking at I'm like

[1:26:34] this is a beautiful system but it kind

[1:26:36] of negates other systems in a sense that

[1:26:39] it's not anusara I mean it's not yoga is

[1:26:41] good for you but anusara yoga is good

[1:26:43] for you and the language of that is what

[1:26:45] bothered me and seemed to really put the

[1:26:48] leader up on a pedestal and everyone not

[1:26:50] everyone but it seemed like there was a

[1:26:51] lot of giving up of people's uh power to

[1:26:56] a guru so to speak and um and that was

[1:27:00] you know I didn't think the whole thing

[1:27:01] would crumble the way it did but um but

[1:27:04] it was a check-in for that you know I

[1:27:07] just wanted if everyone to speak to that

[1:27:10] point I think all systems run the risk

[1:27:13] of

[1:27:14] insularity you know whatever field it is

[1:27:17] or whatever tradition it is and and and

[1:27:21] that's a real concern and a and a a real

[1:27:24] contemp compation you know that if

[1:27:26] within a system of course if someone's

[1:27:28] deeply aligned in a system and that's

[1:27:29] what they're choosing and devoting

[1:27:31] themselves to on some level they do

[1:27:34] think it's the best but the remembrances

[1:27:37] is that it's the best for that

[1:27:39] individual and that in that particular

[1:27:41] wave of time and you know for me I've I

[1:27:46] was with anusar from from it's Little

[1:27:50] Seedling days from the very

[1:27:52] beginning and I can tell you what with

[1:27:54] all honesty I never experienced anusara

[1:27:58] as the best I it for me it was a it was

[1:28:01] a the most

[1:28:03] gorgeous Solid Ground that I could plant

[1:28:07] my feet in and grow my creativity and

[1:28:10] collaborate with all my friends I mean

[1:28:13] this is how I met Janet and um Jason and

[1:28:17] Nicholas and Amanda you know I was an

[1:28:19] anusara teacher but we wo together we've

[1:28:23] been weaving together for several years

[1:28:25] you know as multiple traditions and it's

[1:28:27] more about you know if if if you align

[1:28:30] deeply in a tradition go for it and be

[1:28:33] masterful and be fluent and be as truly

[1:28:37] lit up as you can be within that

[1:28:39] tradition and system and then remember

[1:28:42] that we're really all one family and one

[1:28:45] yoga and take our Mastery and weave it

[1:28:47] together and create the most gorgeous

[1:28:50] tapestry possible out of the Mastery and

[1:28:53] the fluency with what we really know and

[1:28:56] this is how I experienced you know

[1:28:58] anusar I'm not rushing to defend it in

[1:29:01] any sort of way I'm just saying that any

[1:29:02] system runs the risk of insularity and

[1:29:06] it will be the responsibility within you

[1:29:09] know the teachers that represent that

[1:29:11] system to pave the way of collaboration

[1:29:15] and co-creation and and to remember the

[1:29:19] bigger wholeness you know of who we all

[1:29:21] are together

[1:29:28] and I think in terms of what Siana

[1:29:29] saying too is that um there there is uh

[1:29:33] I mean I also taught Anar for many years

[1:29:36] and when when I decided to leave the

[1:29:39] system the very first thing every single

[1:29:42] Studio that I was working with asked me

[1:29:44] what are you going to call it right they

[1:29:46] actually wanted a brand name what are

[1:29:47] you going to call it because brand is

[1:29:49] easy to sell and in in terms of a global

[1:29:52] brand it was just something something

[1:29:54] that so many people had a great

[1:29:56] experience with and they uh became

[1:29:59] attracted to that experience not

[1:30:01] necessarily to most people actually

[1:30:03] didn't know who started anusar where it

[1:30:05] came from when when I traveled in

[1:30:07] different parts of the world they had no

[1:30:09] idea who John was right but they' had a

[1:30:12] a connection with their local teacher

[1:30:14] who was feeding them this uh this love

[1:30:17] of the practice that was that was very

[1:30:19] skillful like SI said and in that sense

[1:30:23] they they started to call at something

[1:30:25] and they said okay that's what I'm

[1:30:26] practicing and I think we we all have a

[1:30:28] hard time putting um kind of we all seek

[1:30:33] to label things we all it's just easy

[1:30:35] that's how we categorize the world

[1:30:36] around us and uh and it was very hard

[1:30:39] for me to tell people I teach yoga you

[1:30:41] know what kind of yoga do you teach uh

[1:30:44] well you know and then you have to give

[1:30:46] them the whole story I did this I

[1:30:47] started a anger I did a I did and you're

[1:30:49] going to say now I'm doing this you know

[1:30:51] so uh and then at the end they go oh

[1:30:53] you're doing your own thing it's like

[1:30:56] yeah okay yes that's what I'm doing um

[1:31:00] but I have no idea how we got into this

[1:31:02] conversation was there was was there a

[1:31:05] root question oh yeah you brought it up

[1:31:10] yeah no and I I agree with SI one of the

[1:31:12] things that it's allowed me to do is

[1:31:14] actually look into myself and when this

[1:31:16] all happened the very first question I

[1:31:18] asked myself is what am I teaching what

[1:31:20] what am I teaching and yes I have these

[1:31:23] tools I have this system system that

[1:31:24] I've grown from and it's acted kind of

[1:31:27] like a a a a planter for my tree to grow

[1:31:30] but what am I teaching and at that

[1:31:33] moment I had to become very very clear

[1:31:35] about what it is I do and why and which

[1:31:37] goes back to what you said earlier is

[1:31:39] why are we doing what we do would we do

[1:31:41] it for free you know and the answer when

[1:31:43] I was breaking away is I had to ask

[1:31:45] myself that question too will I continue

[1:31:47] to do this for free if I go in tomorrow

[1:31:50] saying it's just yoga and there's nobody

[1:31:53] there am I okay with that

[1:31:54] and my answer was yes I'm okay with that

[1:31:57] um I'm very happy there was people

[1:32:01] there so but uh and I'm I'm really I'm

[1:32:04] actually I think like you said it's the

[1:32:07] white water in the ocean is that it it

[1:32:09] was something that we all had to um kind

[1:32:12] of an obstacle that was presented to the

[1:32:14] community the world community at large I

[1:32:16] don't go anywhere now on the planet

[1:32:18] where people have not heard about that

[1:32:20] so it has become an obstacle that has

[1:32:22] allowed us to grow on so many levels I

[1:32:26] mean for myself just reaching out to

[1:32:28] other communities and dropping all that

[1:32:30] and saying okay like what's what's

[1:32:32] blissology about you know I want to get

[1:32:35] some of that you know so but and I think

[1:32:38] it's just an opportunity so thanks

[1:32:40] brother okay on that note guys we are

[1:32:43] going to have to wrap it up but can we

[1:32:44] please just put our hands together that

[1:32:45] was one of that's incredible thank you

[1:32:47] all so much awesome

[1:32:50] [Music]

ArtistSianna Sherman

Sianna Sherman is a yoga teacher and the founder of Rasa Yoga Collective, an organization dedicated to yoga education and community. She teaches classes and trainings international…

View profile Website

Explore Topics

Got Questions?

Frequently Asked Questions

What makes yoga teaching different from other professions in terms of ethics and boundaries?

Unlike medicine, law, and psychology, yoga has no formal regulatory boards, licensing requirements, or legal boundaries protecting students. Teachers must police themselves through personal integrity and community culture rather than institutional oversight.

Is touch okay in yoga teaching?

Touch itself is not the problem—yoga is fundamentally about touch through adjustments. The question is whether it comes from the teacher's genuine care for the student's wellbeing or from the teacher's own need for connection, control, or validation.

Can a romantic relationship develop between a yoga teacher and student?

While some relationships have navigated this transition skillfully, the panel suggests that a teacher and romantic partner cannot simultaneously maintain both roles. If a romantic connection arises, the teaching relationship should end to avoid the inherent conflict of interest.

How should yoga teachers handle money from students?

The panel emphasizes clarity and intention rather than rigid rules. Teachers should be transparent about why they accept or decline donations, and should not pretend the financial reality of teaching doesn't exist while simultaneously relying on student donations.

What is the ultimate safeguard against teacher misconduct in yoga?

The teacher's own practice and self-knowledge. If a teacher knows their practice deeply and remains aware of their ego, projections, and needs, they can make conscious, skillful choices that prioritize the student's growth over their own comfort or validation.

What role does transference play in student-teacher relationships?

Students often project parental figures or idealized versions of themselves onto teachers. Teachers must be aware of these projections and of their own counter-transference (their emotional reactions to students) to maintain healthy boundaries.